News Oculus & Sanzaru Announce Epic Norse Mythology ARPG Asgard's Wrath

Alextended

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Asgard's Wrath
Unleash the wrath of the Gods in a mythical Norse adventure. Forge your destiny as both a mortal hero and living god in an action rpg of unworldly depth.
Wield the diverse powers of several deadly heroes with a revolutionary combat system only possible in VR.
Explore and interact with a rich Norse fantasy world. Recruit loyal animal companions to fight by your side.
Step into the shoes of a towering Norse deity and square off against godly rivals. Jump between human and immortal scales on your journey to become a legend.
Dwell among the captivating gods and goddesses of a an awe-inspiring mythical world.

I'm excited, there's only a tiny bit of gameplay in the trailer but it's by the developers of the well-received (at least in terms of systems if not the actual content) Marvel Powers United VR game and is told to have been in the making for a few years now. If the combat is half as good as that seen in Blade & Sorcery yet the game really is the ~30 hour epic journey it's being reported as by the VR news websites it's going to be one awesome and meaty VR experience :)

You can check out more game screenshots and information in these (and others I guess) articles.
Oculus Unveils Viking Melee Adventure 'Asgard's Wrath' for Rift, Trailer Here
Asgard's Wrath Is A 30+ Hour Norse-Inspired Action RPG Rift Exclusive
Asgard's Wrath Is Virtual Reality's Promising New Step
 
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It honestly bothers me that they're pulling from Horizon and God of War pretty liberally here. I wish Oculus would fund some very original games. I don't think people come to VR for clones, even if it has VR gameplay, right?
 
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Alextended

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I mean, gameplay is what primarily makes games different, if a game has the exact same gameplay as another but a different story and setting then they can be very easily described as very much alike (like even sequels can be decribed as such, same gameplay, some tweaks, different stories to go through). Saying just "VR gameplay" as if it's just a minor detail (or to imply "VR gameplay" is a single thing as if it doesn't take great ideas and craftsmanship for VR games to be good) while every other more important design element makes it "a clone" sounds a bit hyperbolic and might as well mean every game is a clone of whatever because in all of the games ever you do action x for goal y if the way you interact with and do things really doesn't fundamentally change the experience.

I don't see anything too similar to God of War anyway (I wonder, is the Rune sequel going to be called a God of War clone when the original Rune predates all of them?). Maybe the throwing-returning axe mentioned (which only appears similar because of the setting that God of War clearly didn't invent, plus it's similar to the studio's previous game's Captain America where he obviously had to have his trademark shield). I really don't see the comparison to Horizon at all (is it the winter or something, plus how is Horizon in any way like God of War for one VR game to be a clone of both at once when one isn't a clone of the other?).

They have other games like Lone Echo (and its multiplayer team sports & team fps siblings Echo VR and Echo Combat) what's that cloning?

I don't even know if this will turn out great for sure, I'm waiting to see more of the gameplay but for now it's exciting and promising for being from a studio that's shown some skill in the past, having a higher budget than usual, higher ambition with offering a progressive adventure or journey (many of the lower budget VR combat based games go for a simpler approach like waves of enemies or otherwise repeatable bite sized content) and because games like Blade & Sorcery have shown how fun, engaging and immersing the concept of in-depth melee combat can be in VR when done well and how it can also be completely different to even on the surface similar non VR experiences like Mount&Blade (not that the latter has any similar structure being a sandbox game with other elements).

I think of it a bit like the difference between playing a gamepad based on-rails shooter versus playing a lightgun shooter like Time Crisis, both can be fun and one doesn't make the other obsolete as they're different experiences that require very different design and features despite both being essentially 3D, on-rails, and having shooting at their core. Not to mention games in one genre can be very different to each other still, for example Ghost Squad vs L.A. Machineguns vs The House of the Dead, just as Blade & Sorcery is different to Gorn and I'm sure Asgard's Wrath will have features that differentiate it beyond the structure.
 
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I mean, gameplay is what primarily makes games different, if a game has the exact same gameplay as another but a different story and setting then they can be very easily described as very much alike (like even sequels can be decribed as such, same gameplay, some tweaks, different stories to go through). Saying just "VR gameplay" as if it's just a minor detail (or to imply "VR gameplay" is a single thing as if it doesn't take great ideas and craftsmanship for VR games to be good) while every other more important design element makes it "a clone" sounds a bit hyperbolic and might as well mean every game is a clone of whatever because in all of the games ever you do action x for goal y if the way you interact with and do things really doesn't fundamentally change the experience.
Gameplay is what differentiates between different, well-designed VR games. But judging from the short clips of gameplay in this video, this one seems to be firmly a 'more of the same' affair. There are so many sword-swinging VR games that do little to nothing to differentiate themselves... Gorn and Blade & Sorcery being the two differentiated titles (both implementing unique physics / gameplay systems), and of course the numerous sword games where swords are but one component of the action.

So, yeah, if this trailer actually obscured the entirety of what makes this game's gameplay unique, that's fine. I suspect they have shown what the game is.

Meanwhile there are original VR games that are doing a whole lot differently, and thinking about what VR can bring to gaming rather than adapting currently existing genres to VR in the most obvious and simplistic possible way.

Every game is not a clone, but this certainly seems to be.

I don't see anything too similar to God of War anyway (I wonder, is the Rune sequel going to be called a God of War clone when the original Rune predates all of them?). Maybe the throwing-returning axe mentioned (which only appears similar because of the setting that God of War clearly didn't invent, plus it's similar to the studio's previous game's Captain America where he obviously had to have his trademark shield). I really don't see the comparison to Horizon at all (is it the winter or something, plus how is Horizon in any way like God of War for one VR game to be a clone of both at once when one isn't a clone of the other?).
They literally took Aloy and slapped her in this game. I mean the design is identical. The theme seems to be a cloning of the new God of War. This doesn't look like classic Rune at all. There are ways to make a game look unique, and they explicitly chose to make this game look like games that are popular and well known today. It's not a coincidence.

They have other games like Lone Echo (and its multiplayer team sports & team fps siblings Echo VR and Echo Combat) what's that cloning?
Oculus Studios had a real strong start publishing, but now I'm concerned that I'm seeing more derivative games and less original games. I'm also concerned that this title seems to feature gameplay that would be easy to duplicate on the upcoming Oculus devices with lower end tracking.

I don't even know if this will turn out great for sure, I'm waiting to see more of the gameplay but for now it's exciting and promising for being from a studio that's shown some skill in the past, having a higher budget than usual, higher ambition with offering a progressive adventure or journey (many of the lower budget VR combat based games go for a simpler approach like waves of enemies or otherwise repeatable bite sized content) and because games like Blade & Sorcery have shown how fun, engaging and immersing the concept of in-depth melee combat can be in VR when done well and how it can also be completely different to even on the surface similar non VR experiences like Mount&Blade (not that the latter has any similar structure being a sandbox game with other elements).
That's the other thing. Making Marvel Powers United has crushed my opinion of the studio. I would have more faith in a nameless developer than one that has demonstrated how poorly they can do.

I love VR, but it is far too early to be making safe bets on games. That will not bring in new gamers. The early decades of traditional games had countless new genres and concepts. The first few years of VR has been filled with a lot of original gameplay as well (the first actually original gameplay in decades across video games, mind). But seeing a title like this being touted is just crushingly disappointing and I see it as worse than a waste of Oculus's resources, but something that will actually hurt the platform.
 
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It's silly to dismiss it from like 2 seconds of combat as being the same as, which game exactly? I've not played anything like that, especially when they already say it has RPG elements so clearly that's going to affect things mechanically just as new God of War is way different to old God of War despite common themes like brutal combat and mythological lore, the implementation clearly matters a lot to the final result. Also the fact it's a long progressive adventure rather than a sandbox arena game like Blade & Sorcery with whatever that entails for the structure, potential interactions with NPCs, objects, puzzles and exploration beyond the core combat that draw you into its intended experience. Marvel VR was fine for what it was, another arena/wave game with a Marvel skin (it was also decently received even if you hated it, it was not my thing either), so, the opposite of what they're doing (or able to do given a higher budget).

At least you went from calling it a God of War/Horizon clone to a clone of undisclosed VR combat games, that's a step up. I mean, maybe there are many single player zombie themed FPS style games in VR, from Arizona Sunshine to A-Tech Cybernetic to Dead Effect 2, but I've yet to play one that I personally love and consider it a good example of both implementation and quality content so if one comes along I'll certainly prefer to actually play and enjoy it than say meh, there's already A-Tech or even one of the better wave shooters I do enjoy so I didn't need this to be made because it's still all about shooting zombies, implementation and content be damned. I'm even researching the Doom 3 BFG VR mod because it sounds like it's my best bet at the moment.

I'm not sure what you mean about the lower end tracking design. About the only games that I can see having real trouble with inside-out tracking (assuming it works, they're not out yet and it's actually only a brand new leak that their upcoming Rift S model might use such a system, Oculus Quest does use it but this game may not even run on it given the graphics as it's powered by a mid-low tier mobile chipset) are the realistic gun games where you have to put the controllers in your face to aim down sights, I don't think WMR VR sets do well with that, and of course things that have you using objects far outside your field of view and therefor outside the cameras' view (an example of that is once again the FPS shooters where you might have gadgets and weapons in holsters at your sides and your shoulders, with WMR you'd have to look somewhat towards them before grabbing them, which is more cumbersome but workable without affecting the game's design). I don't see any concessions in this game, maybe it simply didn't have those design goals to begin with. Many, many games are already okay in WMR sets without taking them in account when they were made (nobody makes WMR specific games) and that's a good thing for VR as long as people who want to get into it are educated on the differences and how having tried one set doesn't mean the experience is identical with all the others, at least until we reach a point where all the different technologies converge into universal capabilities in practice, but for now the main PCVR sets are close enough in many cases, with PSVR being further behind but workable for many experiences that are then ported back and forth, or aren't if they wouldn't work.

Concessions are something that's done all the time as well, maybe for example the inside out tracking set ups have the drawbacks I mentioned but on the other hand they have full 360 degree freedom out of the box unlike many (most?) Oculus Rift sets out there (like mine currently) which are set up with 2 sensors for primarily front/side facing VR. That games are generally made to work with all these different setups is a good thing and gives consumers choice. One might as well say anything that isn't on the level of Unseen Diplomacy (or to take it further on the level of The Void VR spaces) is not worthwhile but that'd be a pretty deeply personal opinion and not at all what most VR gamers would agree with, being happy to play good games even if they'd be perceived as less than what the platform as a whole can fulfill, just as we can still play great simple arcade games even in the era of the cinematic immersive adventure or whatever.

Nowhere did I say this is a safe bet. Nor did I see anyone else go wow, this game looks like shit so I'll never get into VR so, okay, opinions. Robo Recall was more than well received in its time despite being just a shooter, polish and content matter in some projects just as much as creativity does in others. Many gamers are now super into Fortnite and Apex Legends not because they were the first battle royale games but because they did it in their own way with the polish and content these larger studios could afford. They also didn't kill non VR gaming just because I didn't like them even though they're super popular, or stop games other than battle royale from being made by others. Dota 2 and League of Legends weren't the first DOTA/MOBA games either, nor was Starcraft the first ever RTS devised, shock-horror! There's room for innovation and iteration and everything inbetween whether discussing in or out of VR experiences.

There are a few boxing games for a VR example, there is Knockout League which is like a Punch-Out style pattern recognition game, then there is The Thrill of the Fight which likes to pretend it's a full simulator of the sport and now there's also Creed which is more arcadey and easier to play and different people (or the same people in different moods) enjoy each, saying there was already a boxing game so we should have just been left with Knockout League (or whatever came first, I'm sure tons of indies tried their own take on boxing/fighting in general) while the others were never made is silly (as if I can decide what a given developer should like to work on) given the wholly different gameplay in all of them. Like Robo Recall wasn't something creative like Budget Cuts yet most certainly didn't appear to hurt VR as a platform (nor did any of the early Oculus funded games which were far more traditional in design and often third person games as they didn't have the Touch controllers back then) you can rest a bit easier and not so concerned over the future of VR resting on a potentially cool (or even if it turns out shit I hate, lol) viking adventure you happen to already dismiss while others hope is as good as its premise.

Personally I also like that VR experiences are maturing and stop making a big deal out of the new levels of interactivity alone since that's something that should be considered to come to VR games by default and instead focus more on providing compelling elements around it, from the gameplay systems to the world design, exploration or story, whatever the given developer wants. I don't have anything against funny tech demos a la Surgeon Simulator in VR or local multiplayer social games like Keep Talking and Nobody Explodes and other creative projects but I also want VR to be used for immersing longform experiences like Lone Echo and Red Matter and now this game and multiplayer mayhem like Contractors (which I like and I'm glad it was made even if Pavlov VR was already a similar thing) and coop tactics like Onward, it's all worthwhile and deserving of and advancing the platform when done well as far as I'm concerned. Maybe someone else can put down Onward as just a Ghost Recon (not Wildlands, the oldies) wannabe in VR but to me it's an amazing experience even at its current early access state and I hope it carries on or if it doesn't that another company will take up the mantle and deliver on the premise rather than go all, meh, someone's already tried to do it so let's not. The same for all the bow games, maybe there are tons but I'm still glad In Death was made because it's my favorite (again in part because it's a long form experience I can immerse myself into although it's a rogue-lite, but it's mechanics are also top notch - it's actually my current VR indie dream that the developers of In Death and Blade & Sorcery collaborate for a new game that takes their best elements and adds more).

That doesn't really look like Aloy to me (not that this character looks like that other character equals to this game being a clone of that game, if an Aloy look alike was in God of War that wouldn't make God of War a Horizon clone), rather like a Viking chick, also GOW didn't invent Norse mythology or other tropes. Still, no matter what's discussed you've already said the studio alone to you means it's going to suck so, whatever they were making you'd have the same opinion, just follow what other studios are making and whatever's closer to your personal vision of what VR should be, that's what I do outside VR too.

Edit: I actually did play a game that you (just you, others would just say it's another game in a similar genre) could consider this to be a clone of for being similar, lol! I've been enjoying Karnage Chronicles lately, it's a very nice linear dungeon crawler with solid (but simpler, not like Blade & Sorcery) combat systems and RPG elements in the form of gear and loot. It's also co-op! It's not without issues and features that I hope Asgard's Wrath handles better but I highly recommend it for sure! Itself it could then also be considered a clone of other VR dungeon crawlers like Dungeon Knight but again, to me implementation and content are king and I couldn't get into others while once I got the hang of Karnage Chronicles' systems it became a joy. I do like the combat core in Blade & Sorcery more but Karnage Chronicles provides a very nice longform adventure so I've been going back to that far more than Blade & Sorcery for now (I guess Blade & Sorcery might be more replayable after I've exhausted the adventure in Karnage Chronicles but that doesn't make it worse by default). I'm still excited for Asgard's Wrath's potential because once again it looks different and cool itself, like any cool game in a genre, we're past the point FPS games were called Doom clones.

TLDR, games in a genre aren't necessarily clones and having great games in a genre doesn't mean I won't be enjoying more great games should they be made.
 
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