News Steam Deck , handheld by Valve - announced for December 2021

Alexandros

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I think you are underestimating the breadth of the Steam library, the sheer API surface (documented and undocumented) available to decades of proprietary Windows games and their respective DRM and anti-cheat solutions, and the depth of the technical issues which will present themselves when trying to get all of it to run flawlessly. I'll say it right now: that's not happening.

I'm more than willing to eat crow if they actually manage to do it (and e.g. PSO2, which is an MMO with a decade of patchworked technology and a semi-custom anti-cheat behind it works at launch), but Valve implying full Steam library compatibility is the biggest (basically only?) mistake with how they've presented the Deck so far IMHO.
I don't disagree at all. In fact I have said multiple times that the idea of the entire Steam library being playable seems like a miracle to me. However, Valve has stated that as a goal so many times now that I believe them. I believe they wouldn't have said that if they didn't think they can make it happen. At the very least I expect them to have all the popular games up and running for launch and patch in support for any outliers. I don't think anyone would care if a random asset flip didn't work.

IT'S HAPPENING....


New EAC in Back4Blood works in Linux
Boy is it a relief seeing you here! Welcome!
 
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Arulan

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IT'S HAPPENING....


New EAC in Back4Blood works in Linux
I can't believe we're almost to the point where the Linux experience has nothing to envy from Windows. I'm a little skeptical of Valve's claim for compatibility, but even more excited that they may have just pulled it off (or even close).

Welcome to the forum! Good to see some familiar faces come over.
 

Knurek

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IT'S HAPPENING....


New EAC in Back4Blood works in Linux
Do you know if Persona 4 works properly under new Proton builds?
Current protonDB reports mention random crashes and videos not playing.
I kid you not, this is the game I'd like to play break my Deck with the most.
 
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Parsnip

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Do you know if Persona 4 works properly under new Proton builds?
Current protonDB reports mention random crashes and videos not playing.
I kid you not, this is the game I'd like to play break my Deck with the most.
I recall from following the linux thread over at era that Valve has semi recently started I guess transcoding certain video formats that don't work and basically just overriding the original videos with those. The example they were using was GG Strive where as recently as month ago the videos didn't work but now do. No idea if the same applies to Persona 4 though.
 
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Readher

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Do you know if Persona 4 works properly under new Proton builds?
Current protonDB reports mention random crashes and videos not playing.
I kid you not, this is the game I'd like to play break my Deck with the most.
I recall my friend installing MPC or similar using protontricks to make videos work. No idea about crashing, though.
 

lashman

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Not unexpected, since we had string leaks for this back in may. But nice to see it confirmed.
they should still do a "workshop for game settings" ... because you just know like half of the devs will completely ignore the API (like they did with new covers, and even cloud saves)
 
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Durante

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they should still do a "workshop for game settings" ... because you just know like half of the devs will completely ignore the API (like they did with new covers, and even cloud saves)
I'd be extremely positively surprised if even half the games released after Deck support it (by checking the API and setting good defaults).
 

lashman

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I'd be extremely positively surprised if even half the games released after Deck support it (by checking the API and setting good defaults).
yeah, pretty much this

i mean - i think we can safely assume that the VAST majority of games older than, like, a year won't be touched at all
 

Knurek

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I'd be extremely positively surprised if even half the games released after Deck support it (by checking the API and setting good defaults).
More like 10% if you're optimistic.
And for games released before Deck, 1% support would be an amazing result
(API support, not being able to run it on the device).
 
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Paul

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What are the chances that there will be a good system level framerate lock that will manage to enforce 30fps across games with correct framepacing?
 

Alexandros

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What are the chances that there will be a good system level framerate lock that will manage to enforce 30fps across games with correct framepacing?
Guaranteed. Valve confirmed that SteamOS 3 will have a framerate limiter, I assume it will be properly framepaced.
 
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Mor

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IT'S HAPPENING....


New EAC in Back4Blood works in Linux
Hey, welcome, glad to see you around here, hope you enjoy the little forum and the conversations :cat-heart-blob: :cat-heart-blob:

Now, about this, EAC on Deck will probably be ready by the time Deck releases in December, so, yeah, I don't think it will be a big problem in the short term.

I believe this is the compositor they'll be using for SteamOS 3.0. You can see some of the available options, including a frame rate limiter.
Yes, a lot of this stuff is mostly for SteamOS 3.0 but some will jump into regular Steam on Windows too.
 

Alexandros

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Digoman

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EAC working on Proton would be pretty awesome and of one of the last big hurdles for the Steam deck. Amazing work Valve has done with that.

As for the settings.... honestly I feel they should do a Geforce Experience kind of program (but you know... not shitty) to auto-configure some games for the fixed hardware. But I don't know if they can do their usual user sourced approach, even on Linux, in a secure way, so there is little chance of that. Still, it would probably really help with the "expanding the PC market" side.

Man.... with all these positive previews... I have no need/use for a Deck.... I don't even have a way to buy one.... but I want it :cryingwhyblob:
 

undu

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I am really interested if (how) Valve will solve the game compatibility problem :huhblob:
There's no magic bullet here: by getting game developers involved in fixing compatibility.

I've been following the (loose) team that's developing proton, dxvk and vkd3d-proton. As much effort as they are putting into fixing remaining issues such as video playback (Media Foundation) or EAC, at some point the developers of the game need to be involved to fix issues as there are too many games with one-off problems. These are better served by distributing the effort instead of a small dedicated team, even if it has been able to go 90% of the way.
 
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Knurek

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Guaranteed. Valve confirmed that SteamOS 3 will have a framerate limiter, I assume it will be properly framepaced.
I wouldn't assume proper framepacing, unless someone who uses it currently can confirm.
Lots of tech companies don't seem to get framepacing (looking at you, From Software).
 
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Minsc

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I'm more excited for Steam Deck than any recent launch - which is weird since it's really just a PC. But I think the changes to PC gaming this will bring if they don't abandon it and the community behind it will be unparalleled. There will be a nice, easy-to-use site that summarizes compatibility and best settings for each iteration of the Steam Deck, along with any configs etc (which I'm hoping can be selected right from the Steam itself in the game page), something like PCGamingWiki but specializing the Steam Deck(s).

The vast number of controls on the device too I find pretty appealing as well. Definitely will be enjoying soaking up all the coverage of the device over the next few months before release - and after it's release it will be fun to see how the community constantly finds ways to improve the device week after week.
 

Alexandros

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I've been wondering about Steam Deck's average performance and I thought that maybe we could get a rough estimate of how Steam Deck will perform by looking at Aya Neo tests? Linus' Doom Eternal comparison between Aya Neo and Steam Deck showed about 60% performance difference.


For example, since Borderlands 3 averages about 40something FPS on 800p Low, wouldn't it make (some) sense to assume that on Steam Deck you could get to 60 fps at 800p Low or 30 fps at 800p medium/high? Does that make sense or am I making a dumb comparison?
 

Durante

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I think that makes a lot more sense than trying to work back from desktop specs. That said, the Linus measurement was in Doom Eternal, which is fantastically optimized to take advantage of modern GPUs, so I'd see that as a best-case scenario. Still, I don't think an average ~50% uplift is too far off (only for GPU-limited scenarios of course, but most scenarios are GPU-limited on the Aya Neo).
 

Ascheroth

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I just realized the Deck means portable Monster Hunter World :thinking-face:
I am very curious how that performs, (though it's not I game I would probably play much portable, but the option is cool).
It will also mean portable Monster Hunter Rice with better graphics and performance than the Switch version - that one I could see myself playing on the Deck actually.
 
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MomoVideo

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I just realized the Deck means portable Monster Hunter World :thinking-face:
I am very curious how that performs, (though it's not I game I would probably play much portable, but the option is cool).
It will also mean portable Monster Hunter Rice with better graphics and performance than the Switch version - that one I could see myself playing on the Deck actually.
MHW runs at about 40-50 fps on Aya Neo when locked at 15W, so I think it's safe to say that 60 fps will be achievable. I'm currently playing MHW with my neighbor and we both got Steam Decks, so I can't wait to relive our old days of playing Monster Hunter Unite together on PSP :blobevening:
 

Alexandros

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"We don't have a strong prediction that a bunch of people are going to choose it as their first PC, but as a lot of people choose to upgrade their existing PCs, we feel fairly confident that Steam Deck will be a choice that they make," Coomer tells me.
Yang agrees. "Yes, I definitely think it's a viable choice. You can do everything you'd do on a PC with it, and it's just a little PC that you can plug stuff into."
That's kinda weird, isn't it? Steam Deck doesn't seem powerful enough to be a meaningful upgrade. Unless Valve is targeting those still playing on old PCs or laptops with slow integrated GPUs?
 
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Le Pertti

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That's kinda weird, isn't it? Steam Deck doesn't seem powerful enough to be a meaningful upgrade. Unless Valve is targeting those still playing on old PCs or laptops with slow integrated GPUs?
I can imagine that a lot of people are on laptops. Also outside gaming most people use laptops. So the deck could be a good first dip into pc gaming.
 

Alexandros

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I would say that's their biggest market, looking at the stats that valve collects and shows.
Well I did some math, I added up the percentage of all video cards from the latest Steam hardware survey and roughly 67% of users have a GTX 1050 or better, so for most people a Steam Deck would be a sidegrade or a downgrade. Obviously 33% of Steam's userbase is nothing to scoff at but I don't know, it seems strange to think of Steam Deck as an upgrade. Especially because there's no guarantee of future AAA performance. Unless the thinking is that Steam Deck at 800p would perform better proportionally than, say, a gtx 1060 at 1080p? Would it?
 
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Mor

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That's kinda weird, isn't it? Steam Deck doesn't seem powerful enough to be a meaningful upgrade. Unless Valve is targeting those still playing on old PCs or laptops with slow integrated GPUs?
Well, if we follow the information the monthly charts display, a lot of people could jump into the Steam Deck a fairly good deal (good price/good power machine) that surpasses their current setup in a lot of ways so, I think Valve is pointing into that direction and it is why the region amplification is so important for them.
 

NarohDethan

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That's kinda weird, isn't it? Steam Deck doesn't seem powerful enough to be a meaningful upgrade. Unless Valve is targeting those still playing on old PCs or laptops with slow integrated GPUs?
I mean at least I can sorta buy a GPU in my country even if it's extremely expensive :p
 

Digoman

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Well I did some math, I added up the percentage of all video cards from the latest Steam hardware survey and roughly 67% of users have a GTX 1050 or better, so for most people a Steam Deck would be a sidegrade or a downgrade. Obviously 33% of Steam's userbase is nothing to scoff at but I don't know, it seems strange to think of Steam Deck as an upgrade. Especially because there's no guarantee of future AAA performance. Unless the thinking is that Steam Deck at 800p would perform better proportionally than, say, a gtx 1060 at 1080p? Would it?
Well, with more access to the data you can probably see exactly where the Steam Deck would be an upgrade, like older 4 cores, 8 GB and at 1080p resolution, so Valve can see things we don't.

I was thinking more about expanding the PC market before, but actually giving a avenue for people with older machines but still active users makes a lot of sense. They will now have an option to update for lot less than before, and that's including probably a way better experience compared to how Windows is running on their machines, while at same time still being able to play whatever games they are currently playing. And all of this in a mobile format.

Even if that's something like "only" 10-20% of the active userbase, I'm guessing after paying for the Deck they are very likely to buy several games from the suddenly vastly expanded catalog they can run.

Between this market, people just wanting portable gaming, and actually expanding the PC market, Valve will probably sell all they can make for for a while... assuming they can nail the software side.
 

Mivey

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That's kinda weird, isn't it? Steam Deck doesn't seem powerful enough to be a meaningful upgrade. Unless Valve is targeting those still playing on old PCs or laptops with slow integrated GPUs?
I can see it as an upgrade in the sense that it adds a new way of playing your existing games, both on your desktop and later taking that experience with you where you want. Your couch, your bed, or go to a nearby park, sit by a tree, put on some headphones and play outside for a spell.

It's a bit weird to try to sell the experience of the Deck when connected to an external monitor as an upgrade for existing PC users, though. That's the least interesting way of using this thing. I already have a powerful machine connected to a monitor, I don't need something with an integrated GPU for that.
 

Digoman

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I don't think there is anything new on that PC Gamer video. Overall they were positive but there was very little actual footage from the device. They just looped b-roll style several times.

I think the worst thing they showed was the system glitching a little and having a small pause in Death Stranding followed by the Steam logo appearing briefly... which of course was placed right at the start of the video (1;19) :p
 
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Alexandros

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Since it seems that Valve is sending those out I hope we get to hear impressions and support plans from developers soon. Also hopefully it won't be long before we get more (and direct) game footage, I'm eager to see how it handles various games.
 
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Mor

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Since it seems that Valve is sending those out I hope we get to hear impressions and support plans from developers soon. Also hopefully it won't be long before we get more (and direct) game footage, I'm eager to see how it handles various games.
The day before LTT went to Valve's HQ, they received a good amount of Developer Kits ready to be sent, that was a week ago IIRC so yeah, we should be getting new info here and there, maybe not big info but some.
 

Stevey

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That's kinda weird, isn't it? Steam Deck doesn't seem powerful enough to be a meaningful upgrade. Unless Valve is targeting those still playing on old PCs or laptops with slow integrated GPUs?
My next upgrade will be a GPU that costs more than the Deck
 

Alexandros

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Personally I'm in a dilemma precisely because Steam Deck would basically be a sidegrade for me and I've always been a budget gamer. I can technically afford buying Steam Deck and upgrading a bit later but I really hate wasting money on things that I don't need. So, if I commit the money to buy Steam Deck I will not be upgrading for at least the next three years. In such a case and since my current PC is roughly at Steam Deck's hardware level (Core i5 6500, 1050ti), if next-gen games start having requirements that both my PC and Steam Deck can't handle I will be locked out of new games for quite some time.

Then again, unless the GPU market situation improves dramatically over the next year I am locked out of upgrading anyway. I usually upgrade a couple of years into each console generation, when I can get a 200ish euro card that comfortably outpaces consoles. Given the current situation it seems we are at least two years away from that happening. For my use case the perfect choice would be a Steam Deck Pro three years from now that would be guaranteed to handle next-gen games. I don't really need a Steam Deck... but man do I want one!

Any advice?
 
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C-Dub

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If you already have a PC, in my mind Steam Deck isn't meant to replace your PC but augment it so you can play games in ways you couldn't before.

I'd not consider it a side-grade or replacement, but closer to an accessory for established PC gamers. If you don't want to budget for that kind of device, don't get one.

Obviously that doesn't mean the Steam Deck isn't a standalone PC, which it is. For people who don't have a gaming PC, it's going to be a great gateway or welcome back to PC gaming. But I wouldn't treat this as your next main system if you've already got one.
 
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