News Tim Sweeney: No "Epic keys" for Exclusive Games

[madjoki]

In Twitter, Tim Sweeney has confirmed Epic won't be supporting keys for exclusive games (or "co-exclusive", in case of Ubisoft games).
Previously Galyonkin has said they will in future, support keys, but I think this detail has been conveniently left out.

Twitter thread:

I think in practice this will mean, we won't really see Epic keys distributed. As I imagine most will want GoG key over anything else.
So keys like Metro Exodus had, will be an exception because physical copies were already promised to distributors.

 

[lashman]

oh man ... you just gotta love all that competition

so combined with them saying they're not really big on sales either ... we can pretty much expect all those games to stay full price for a year ...

thanks, epic



also - could someone please remind me what exactly is a "monopoly"?

 

[FreakOrama]

The more time passes, the more devs (that went with the exclusive option) will have realized that the EGS deal was good short-term, bad long term.

 

[itsamiracle]

also - could someone please remind me what exactly is a "monopoly"?

Valve seems to have the monopoly of media criticism these days

 

[Digoman]

I think in practice this will mean, we won't really see Epic keys distributed. As I imagine most will want GoG key over anything else.
So keys like Metro Exodus had, will be an exception because physical copies were already promised to distributors.

The fact that The Division 2 keys stopped being sold after launch already pointed to a change in strategy. Since we have no idea of sales on EGS we can only speculate, but my guess is they are finding out that people prefer to buy anywhere else

And it also again shows that they have no long term plan and are just reacting to events.

also - could someone please remind me what exactly is a "monopoly"?

I don't know what is the definition here... it changes so much. On Era I'm sure someone with a "degree in economics" will show up soon enough with some crazy definition that forgets the "mono" part.

 

[lashman]

Valve seems to have the monopoly of media criticism these days

oh ... that's for sure ... sigh

And it also again shows that they have no long term plan and are just reacting to events.

yup, they're making shit up as they go along ... it's so painfully obvious from the day they announced that thing

 

[uraizen]

"Let's dig into that topic..."

Sure, but you were already given a starting point. Now answer why.

 

[Le Pertti]

What about retail keys?

 

[Copons]

One thing that always baffled me when talking with folks that don't like Steam, is that they always mention how Valve takes a 30% cut, but never ever talk about the almost-infinite keys that can be sold anywhere for free.
When I point it out, they disregard it with a , even if they are devs or anyway directly involved with games on Steam.

So I guess there are two possibilities here:

• Either the selling numbers of keys on third party sites are so low to be negligible.
• Or it's about time that Valve gets a proper fucking marketing team to showcase all the Steam features, because it's kinda not my job to do it for them!

 

[Hektor]

The more time passes, the more devs (that went with the exclusive option) will have realized that the EGS deal was good short-term, bad long term.

I'm certain most of the devs getting the short term benefits won't care about the long term issues..

 

[itsamiracle]

What about retail keys?

I imagine those are Uplay keys? From the cdkeys site:

 

[Naer]

EGS, in the long term, could be so positive for us if they were doing this things in a more customer friendly approach, but, it seems like they are trying to do it in the worst possible way.

You can't be the last one and pretend to change game rules from day one.

 

[lashman]

One thing that always baffled me when talking with folks that don't like Steam, is that they always mention how Valve takes a 30% cut, but never ever talk about the almost-infinite keys that can be sold anywhere for free.
When I point it out, they disregard it with a , even if they are devs or anyway directly involved with games on Steam.

So I guess there are two possibilities here:

• Either the selling numbers of keys on third party sites are so low to be negligible.
• Or it's about time that Valve gets a proper fucking marketing team to showcase all the Steam features, because it's kinda not my job to do it for them!

yeah, exactly ...

or like when you point out the whole laundry list of all the features steam has and people go "well, i don't use any of that, so it doesn't matter" ... like WUT?

EGS, in the long term, could be so positive for us if they were doing this things in a more customer friendly approach, but, it seems like they are trying to do it in the worst possible way.

You can't be the last one and pretend to change game rules from day one.

yeah, pure hypocrisy from everyone involved since day one

 

[TheVectronic]

I think in practice this will mean, we won't really see Epic keys distributed. As I imagine most will want GoG key over anything else.
So keys like Metro Exodus had, will be an exception because physical copies were already promised to distributors.

Oh that’s a big no-no. Steam flourishes from 3rd party sellers like Humble, Fanatical, among others.

So preventing that market to sell specific games makes so that:

1) people don’t play your game

2) if they do want to play it, they would rather get a cracked version of it.

Wait a hot minute, that’s what Metro: Exodus did & look how that turned out.

The more time passes, the more devs (that went with the exclusive option) will have realized that the EGS deal was good short-term, bad long term

Pretty much why those “exclusive” games tend to have a 1 year exclusivity plan. Sorta like how Rise of Tomb Raider with the Timed Exclusivity deal with the Xbox 360/One.

It would be horrible long term to be a permanent exclusive when that audience actively despises that storefront.

If anything’s clear to me, Epic wants to corner the PC marketplace in anyway possible. Though it’s unlikely they’ll succeed if stuff like this keeps piling up against using the platform.

 

[curi0usBystander]

I mean, this was kind of obvious. With their 88/12 model if they were to offer 3rd party keys they would either:

• Have to be offered with the same split (which I doubt would happen).
• Or have to be offered at the current split meaning they would always undercut the EGS (so they would make no money).

I suppose they will only allow keys for physical copies, and they will probably search a workaround so they cannot be resold (or maybe they will charge for key generation, which would be funny).

This basically means that their games will have the price fixed (well for a year If they end up being sold in other places), I wonder how well that will work.

 

[lashman]

This basically means that their games will have the price fixed (well for a year If they end up being sold in other places), I wonder how well that will work.

they already said they won't be doing sales, so ... yeah

 

[freshVeggie]

Please stop with all this competition Epic. This is too good for me as a customer.

 

[Copons]

or like when you point out the whole laundry list of all the features steam has and people go "well, i don't use any of that, so it doesn't matter" ... like WUT?

Dammit, I've stopped counting all the times someone told me "but what about the cards? they suck bad! what a shitty store", and I'm like WTF, because really WTF can you even reply to something like that

 

[lashman]

Dammit, I've stopped counting all the times someone told me "but what about the cards? they suck bad! what a shitty store", and I'm like WTF, because really WTF can you even reply to something like that

nothing ... absolutely nothing

 

[Firewithin]

i know we need to save the guillotines for the rich but we can surely spare a couple for Epic right?

 

[curi0usBystander]

they already said they won't be doing sales, so ... yeah

Yeah I remember that, which makes me wonder: are those games supposed to keep selling after their launch window (not that it matters since epic has already paid them).

 

[Deleted member 113]

I don't know why everyone is surprised, all this was pretty clear, and expected since the very beginning.
Epic is quite simply trying to take out other retailers in the PC digital space, and be able to dictate pricing on the platform. Steam is always brought up, but honestly, Steam isn't going anywhere.
But retailers like Fanatical? Voidu? Green Man Gaming? 2Game? Wingamestore? Yeah, if most big titles go to Epic, all these will be gone. There's simply not enough money to be made to support the re-sale of keys by all these people. It's not by selling keys to games that are several years old that these websites will survive.
Even Humble and GOG will struggle quite badly to survive. Heck, even those grey area stores like CDKeys, since without retail copies for these games, you aren't getting keys there either.

Don't like what Epic, and the developers and publishers that make these agreements with them, are doing?
There's a simple solution to all of this: don't support them.

Don't buy their games. Not on Epic. And not elsewhere either, after the exclusivity period ends (since, you would only be rewarding these developers and publishers, who would get the best of both worlds: a sizeable money hat/guaranteed revenue, and then healthy sales one year later), nor on other platforms (such as consoles) since, again, you would still be supporting them and giving them money.

There's no point in continuing to bring out these poor, appalling practices if everyone then goes out, and buys their games anyway.
As long as these people continue to get money, this will not stop.

 

[lashman]

i know we need to save the guillotines for the rich but we can surely spare a couple for Epic right?

well Tim IS a billionaire ...

 

[Firewithin]

well Tim IS a billionaire ...

perfect. two birds one guillotine

 

[Ge0force]

So Epic isn't only crippling competing storefronts like Steam and GoG, but their moneyhats are crippling official keystores as well? I'm not sure if I can handle so much heavily competition...

 

[Deleted member 113]

So Epic isn't only crippling competing storefronts like Steam and GoG, but their moneyhats are crippling official keystores as well? I'm not sure if I can handle so much heavily competition...

Yeah, exactly that.
You know that image everyone keeps posting about "competition", featuring the pages of certain games on Isthereanydeal where only the Epic Store is listed?
That's what you can count on, if people keep supporting Epic and their store, and the games that are part of these agreements.

Oh, and those Fanatical or Humble bundles with big titles? Yeah, not gonna happen either.

You can buy Steam keys on most key re-sellers.
You can buy Uplay keys on most key re-sellers.
You can buy Origin keys on most key re-sellers.
You can buy Bethesda Launcher keys on most key re-sellers.
You can buy GOG keys on several key re-sellers.
You can buy Battle.net keys on some key-resellers, and you can buy physical retail copies that include them.
Even Telltale Games had keys for their own website/client sold on most key re-sellers.

Epic's intention is to not sell Epic Game Store keys for their exclusives, not on key re-sellers, not even on physical, retail copies. Nowhere.

 

[Derrick01]

Good. This will hurt their sales even more over time and plus we don't have to worry about retailers not stocking steam keys and only epic keys or some bullshit along those lines. Although who knows they're such a scum company they'll probably move to do that too at some point just to spite consumers even more.

 

[lashman]

Good. This will hurt their sales even more over time and plus we don't have to worry about retailers not stocking steam keys and only epic keys or some bullshit along those lines. Although who knows they're such a scum company they'll probably move to do that too at some point just to spite consumers even more.

wouldn't surprise me

 

[Deleted member 113]

Good. This will hurt their sales even more over time and plus we don't have to worry about retailers not stocking steam keys and only epic keys or some bullshit along those lines. Although who knows they're such a scum company they'll probably move to do that too at some point just to spite consumers even more.

Sadly, I don't think it's good.
Because, they have money to take the hit for a significant period. These authorized key re-sellers don't.
If the big titles start becoming Epic exclusives, the re-sellers won't be able to carry them, and they will go down much faster, while for Epic it would only be a minor blip to lose a few million during a certain period.

 

[lashman]

Sadly, I don't think it's good.
Because, they have money to take the hit for a significant period. These authorized key re-sellers don't. They will go down much faster, while for Epic it would only be a minor blip.

oh, absolutely ... i'm sure they WANT to kill all those stores too ... so people don't have a choice anymore

 

[C-Dub]

I wanted Epic Game Store to change course and become a good place for customers and developers, but at this point I just want it to go away. They're hurting the platform.

I just hope they don't do too much damage before Epic writes PC gamers off as pirates and goes back to consoles. And I hope we don't see any indie developers hurting in the long run from making an ill-informed decision to take the bag of money plopped in front of them, but you know some of them are going to damage their brand and reputation making and/or defending their decision to go EGS exclusive.

 

[lashman]

I wanted Epic Game Store to change course and become a good place for customers and developers, but at this point I just want it to go away. They're hurting the platform.

I just hope they don't do too much damage before Epic writes PC gamers off as pirates and goes back to consoles. And I hope we don't see any indie developers hurting in the long run from making an ill-informed decision to take the bag of money plopped in front of them, but you know some of them are going to damage their brand and reputation making and/or defending their decision to go EGS exclusive.

unfortunately it's only going to get worse from now on ....

epic ... every big publisher making their own store, no matter how awful (look at bethesda) ... and then there's google - there is no way in hell they won't be moneyhatting exclusives as well ... except with them it's even worse because those games will be streaming-only (i believe) ... and probably not timed

basically - PC gaming is going back to mid-2000s ... only this time around it's going to be MUCH worse than back then

and it makes me sad

 

[C-Dub]

unfortunately it's only going to get worse from now on ....

epic ... every big publisher making their own store, no matter how awful (look at bethesda) ... and then there's google - there is no way in hell they won't be moneyhatting exclusives as well ... except with them it's even worse because those games will be streaming-only (i believe) ... and probably not timed

basically - PC gaming is going back to mid-2000s ... only this time around it's going to be MUCH worse than back then

and it makes me sad

I try not to be defeatist about these things. I remember people were losing their minds over UWP, but Microsoft eventually decided they didn't want to fight the tide on that. Maybe Epic or people they are grooming for exclusives will feel the same. And if the market can't sustain this bullshit then the market (or parts of it) will crash. But it'll recover long after a lot of these dogshit clients have cratered, and I don't think Steam is going anywhere in the meantime.

What worries me more is GOG taking another hit. They do good work and I buy lots of games through them, but Epic's shenanigans seems to have hurt them more than Steam. No surprise when developers, emboldened by Epic's bullshit, start demanding stores take unsustainable cuts. Whereas Steam is currently in a position to wait and see what they can do to give everyone a better deal (and I think they may announce certain changes to revenue share down the line), a site like GOG has to react quickly and race to the bottom. As a result, players in certain regions have now lost their Fair Price Package. So thanks for that, Epic.

The best thing to do is not give them your money and encourage others to do the same. For what it's worth, today I was speaking to a friend at work who is a more casual PC gamer, and he thinks what Epic is doing is utter bullshit. While in no way is that a representative sample, I think word is getting around that their store is rotten.

 

[lashman]

The best thing to do is not give them your money and encourage others to do the same. For what it's worth, today I was speaking to a friend at work who is a more casual PC gamer, and he thinks what Epic is doing is utter bullshit. While in no way is that a representative sample, I think word is getting around that their store is rotten.

i REALLY hope that will be the case ... i really do

 

[crimsonheadGCN]

I hope that's the case too.

 

[Ge0force]

I really hope so as well. But the way the media supports Epic is a huge problem. Most of my colleagues and friends who play games are casual gamers or play games like Dota most of the time. But since they don't visit Era or Reddit, they aren't even aware of Epic's bullshit - at least not until until I told them about it. ^^

 

[lashman]

I really hope so as well. But the way the media supports Epic is a huge problem. Most of my colleagues and friends who play games are casual gamers or play games like Dota most of the time. But since they don't visit Era or Reddit, they aren't even aware of Epic's bullshit - at least not until until I told them about it. ^^

yeah, at this point it just has to be word of mouth ... doesn't seem like people can count on anyone else