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[SRossi]

it happened ... in their discord .... i've seen like 10 people (people i trust) saying it happened .... so it happened

besides - we all know how certain people can behave when stuff like that happens, so i have ZERO doubt it happened, and i don't need to see proof

what should've happened after that announcement was just people saying "well i'm not gonna buy your game then, if you feel this way" and moving on AT MOST ... not sending them porn, gore and death threats

well, i don't know them, i don't trust them, it's not hard to take a screencap. so as long i haven't seen it, it didn't happen. and no, what you proposed should have happened isn't enough of an reaction to their insults. for all i know and how i read their posts on discord and twitter they are the type of people that can dish out but at the first sign of resistance they are "harassed" by the toxic gamers. fuck them, fuckwits.

Exactly. Proportional response. They don't owe us a game until we give them money specifically for a copy/if you backed on kickstarter and the game actually releases. We owe them not to steal the game. That's it. Proportional response is to cancel preorder, cancel patreon, not purchase game in the future. Not to harass for days.

letting them now they are arrogant lying insulting assholes is a proportional response.

 

[ISee]

whole argument yesterday was that angry gamers are the worst

No idea if something conditioned you to think that people playing video games are the worst by design or if that's just the only group of people you are interacting with, because please speak to an angry sport fan after his team lost and the trainer made a bade (or questionable) decision. And do not forget to ask a hardcore Star Wars Fan what he thinks about Episode 1-3 or the new movies. Ask a TNG fan what he thinks about the new Discovery show.
How about Disney Fans reacting to "Black Ariel", or the take of Witcher Fans on the casting of the new Netflix show.

You'll find that being toxic and stupid isn't reserved to gamer, it's not even the worst contender. You'll find that it's a "passion" thing across all hobbies, the more a person is into something the harsher, more unreasonable and extreme he'll become. Not always, but often enough.
And you'll find over-passionate, unreasonable people in all fandoms, across all social "levels" and across all ages.

Other hobbies, like soccer do not have idiots that are for example called hooligans or "Ultras" who worship violence and literally beat up innocent people because they cheer for a different team. Harley Davidson fans didn't start to build gang like structures and became criminals. It's those extreme, idiotic gamers that are the worst of the worst and no other hobby has serious problems with fans taking things way too far.

Yes, they are bad. But this isn't a gaming problem, it's a human problem.

edit:
Do you even know how the germans are dealing with angry sports fans? Those "fans" are being escorted by the police from and to the stadium. Not to guard them but to protect everybody else from them.



just skip through the video.

 

[lashman]

isn't enough of an reaction to their insults.

yes, it is ... calling them names, sending death threats and all that other shit is DEFINITELY not a proportionate response

it's one thing to just not think too highly of them ... and a COMPLETELY different thing directly insulting them

 

[Trisolarian]

well, i don't know them, i don't trust them, it's not hard to take a screencap. so as long i haven't seen it, it didn't happen. and no, what you proposed should have happened isn't enough of an reaction to their insults. for all i know and how i read their posts on discord and twitter they are the type of people that can dish out but at the first sign of resistance they are "harassed" by the toxic gamers. fuck them, fuckwits.

letting them now they are arrogant lying insulting assholes is a proportional response.

For days?

I mean, honestly, I'd rather be the bigger person in this instance. A lot of people wrote to them that they were assholes and now congrats! another notch in the dev vs audience and media vs audience war.

 

[lashman]

Yes, they are bad. But this isn't a gaming problem, it's a human problem.

actually - it's a capitalism problem

 

[NarohDethan]

Funny how most people defending Epic are the most ignorant people about PC gaming as a whole. Valve singlehandedly is saving gaming in Linux, literally for free, but I guess that doesnt count because Linux is for basement virgins or something.

Third party key sellers and regional pricing are a blessing for folks in poorer countries, but that doesnt count because G2A exists or something.

 

[RionaaM]

Yup. This is the issue with today's Era. No nuance, no bigger picture. You point out that there is a history and suddenly you are victim-blaming.
Personally, I would have banned the people who inappropriately compared the ooblets Situation with sexual harassment on the street because of the clothes she wears. THAT downplays sexual harassment on the street.

I said it yesterday, someone will point to some fuckwits and suddenly ANY criticism is harassment. Half of the criticizers changes their stance and the other half is banned or shuts up.

Could we please stop talking about other forums? There are some ugly places that focus on specific forums and talking bad about them, I don't want Meta to become one of those.

 

[SRossi]

yes, it is ... calling them names, sending death threats and all that other shit is DEFINITELY not a proportionate response

it's one thing to just not think too highly of them ... and a COMPLETELY different thing directly insulting them

lets agree to disagree here. and i don't know why you are coming with the death threads again. i said calling them fuckwits is ok. i agreed that sending porn or gore is not cool. i don't know where the death threads are coming from now but im sure you have a reason.

For days?

I mean, honestly, I'd rather be the bigger person in this instance.

sure why not. fuck being the bigger person.

 

[NarohDethan]

And funny how people love to tell that we're just dumb fanboys but have no problem going to twitter or forums to get those sick ownz when the Switch shits on other consoles' sales or when the PS4 gets a new exclusive.

 

[lashman]

i said calling them fuckwits is ok

not to their face it's not

that's all i'm trying to say

 

[SRossi]

not to their face it's not

that's all i'm trying to say

lol to what then? sure to their fucking faces. because that's what they are. fuckwits.

 

[NarohDethan]

not to their face it's not

that's all i'm trying to say

Yup. Call Tim a cunt here all you want, going to his email or phone to tell him to fuck off is fucked up.

 

[Trisolarian]

lol to what then? sure to their fucking faces. because that's what they are. fuckwits.

Its different when its the sheer volume of people that an internet dogpile can produce.

Plus, it just isn't worth it to continue to feed the fire of dev vs audience.

I browsed a bit of the usual gaming media sites, the discussion is now also about the response to the decision and some of the shittiness from people who play (or say they play) games. Keep up the dogpile and that will be most of what people remember.

 

[lashman]

Its different when its the sheer volume of people that an internet dogpile can produce.

Plus, it just isn't worth it to continue to feed the fire of dev vs audience.

☝ this

 

[beep boop]

Meanwhile GabeN from 4 years ago:

Accurate as it turns out.

 

[Alexandros]

Well at least that thread wasn't a total waste, it gave us this gem:

I get that this kind of sucks, but isn't climate change a much bigger deal?

I love you, random internet person.

Ask a TNG fan what he thinks about the new Discovery show.

Ooh, me, me! It sucks balls!

 

[derFeef]

No idea if something conditioned you to think that people playing video games are the worst by design or if that's just the only group of people you are interacting with, because please speak to an angry sport fan after his team lost and the trainer made a bade (or questionable) decision. And do not forget to ask a hardcore Star Wars Fan what he thinks about Episode 1-3 or the new movies. Ask a TNG fan what he thinks about the new Discovery show.
How about Disney Fans reacting to "Black Ariel", or the take of Witcher Fans on the casting of the new Netflix show.

You'll find that being toxic and stupid isn't reserved to gamer, it's not even the worst contender. You'll find that it's a "passion" thing across all hobbies, the more a person is into something the harsher, more unreasonable and extreme he'll become. Not always, but often enough.
And you'll find over-passionate, unreasonable people in all fandoms, across all social "levels" and across all ages.

Other hobbies, like soccer do not have idiots that are for example called hooligans or "Ultras" who worship violence and literally beat up innocent people because they cheer for a different team. Harley Davidson fans didn't start to build gang like structures and became criminals. It's those extreme, idiotic gamers that are the worst of the worst and no other hobby has serious problems with fans taking things way too far.

Yes, they are bad. But this isn't a gaming problem, it's a human problem.

edit:
Do you even know how the germans are dealing with angry sports fans? Those "fans" are being escorted by the police from and to the stadium. Not to guard them but to protect everybody else from them.



just skip through the video.

I am well aware of all of this and in no need of a teaching lesson. (that sounds a bit harsh mind you, I don't mean it personally, you always make this great elaborate posts).

I thought when someone says "the worst" it just means "they are bad" without a comparing factor. English is not my main language mind you.

 

[AHA-Lambda]

Oh man that climate change dig is fucking ace

 

[Knurek]

Could we please stop talking about other forums? There are some ugly places that focus on specific forums and talking bad about them, I don't want Meta to become one of those.

Become?
Baby, depends on who you ask we're either worse than wombatfarms or more gay hippies than ResetEON.
Remember, there's no nuance on the internet. You're either for something or you're a toxic gamer.

 

[Swenhir]

They literally caused it though. They literally openly mocked people in their announcement.

They have caused it but there's a difference between harassment and protesting. Voicing your displeasure isn't the former. I think.

I mean we both know how it goes from here and I'd rather it didn't.

 

[ISee]

Ooh, me, me! It sucks balls!

Where is my liked x4000 button?

I thought when someone says "the worst" it just means "they are bad" without a comparing factor. English is not my main language mind you.

From one non native speaker to another. I don't know. I have the feeling there is a strong comparing factor when using "the worst" but I'd be happy to learn if I'm wrong.

 

[Eferis]

So in all this we have

1. Two morons (one in particular) who thought that being all antagonistic and inflammatory towards huge web communities was a good idea;
2. A bunch of morons who took this as just another reason to harass people on the Internet, faking stuff while the guy was already doing pretty bad on his own and sending death threats;
3. The biggest moron worth 9 billion dollars who, instead of defending those less experienced developers who signed an exclusivity deal with his damn company, threw them even more to the lions with that fucking "IT WAS AWESOME" tweet.


And in all this, all those people politely expressing disappointment and concerns, are being equated with GGers.

What a shitshow.

 

[AHA-Lambda]

At least RPS are showing themselves to be competent

Epic's CEO shouldn't be riling the mob going after Ooblets over its Epic exclusivity

As many good-lookin' small-budget games are wont to, Ooblets has signed a timed exclusivity deal with the Epic Games St…

www.rockpapershotgun.com

 

[ISee]

At least RPS are showing themselves to be competent

Epic's CEO shouldn't be riling the mob going after Ooblets over its Epic exclusivity

As many good-lookin' small-budget games are wont to, Ooblets has signed a timed exclusivity deal with the Epic Games St…

www.rockpapershotgun.com

It's something, the tone is still very pro Ooblet and not nearly neutral enough etc.
I still believe reporting should be as neutral as possible.
But there is at least some kind of criticism and willingness to look at the situation from a bit further away.

 

[Trisolarian]

At least RPS are showing themselves to be competent

Epic's CEO shouldn't be riling the mob going after Ooblets over its Epic exclusivity

As many good-lookin' small-budget games are wont to, Ooblets has signed a timed exclusivity deal with the Epic Games St…

www.rockpapershotgun.com

Nice job Tim.

RPS is correct, Tim gets shit but probably has his PR team block people on twitter after he pours gasoline.

 

[m_dorian]

Harassment and death threats will always be a bigger story than examining the real reasons behind the issues. It will always sell more.
And, if nothing else this is why these reactions should stop or at least come to a minimum.
They do not help and they are shadowing the real problem.

 

[Dandy]

The RPS article makes some good points... but it also somewhat minimizes the affect the developer's words had on the reaction to the announcement.

 

[Cordelia]

Seen the thread on that other site. Holy shit people just conveniently ignore the blogpost that caused most of the outrage. Even reddit is more level headed on that article.

 

[Kyougar]

Epic’s Statement on Misinformation & Abuse

Epic’s Statement on Misinformation & Abuse

www.epicgames.com

We at Epic Games have often shared our views about the game business and companies in it, and we support the entire game community’s right to speak freely and critically about these topics, including the topic of Epic, our products, and our store. When everyone shares their earnest views, the best ideas ultimately prevail.

The announcement of Ooblets highlighted a disturbing trend which is growing and undermining healthy public discourse, and that’s the coordinated and deliberate creation and promotion of false information, including fake screenshots, videos, and technical analysis, accompanied by harassment of partners, promotion of hateful themes, and intimidation of those with opposing views.

Epic is working together with many game developers and other partners to build what we believe will be a healthier and more competitive multi-store world for the future. We remain fully committed, and we will steadfastly support our partners throughout these challenges. Many thanks to all of you that continue to promote and advocate for healthy, truthful discussion about the games business and stand up to all manners of abuse.

 

[Cordelia]

No mention of the developer's condescending posts

 

[Derrick01]

The irony of Tim/Epic putting that statement out on the same day that Trump talked about how we need to end the problems that he's been stoking for years is the most beautiful fucking thing I've seen in a while.

 

[Nabs]

No mention of the developer's condescending posts

Or Sweeney's own bullshit.

Or their own misinformation campaign.

And they're trying to build a "more competitive multi-store world" by removing games from all stores. Okay.

Epic now controls the narrative.

 

[Knurek]

Epic now controls the narrative.

That, sadly, has been true for the past few months.

 

[NarohDethan]

But didnt Tim say that the reactions were awesome?

 

[unknownhero]

what I'm fearing is coming true as well, those with legit criticisms are being lumped with being a toxic gaming man baby.

 

[Trisolarian]

But didnt Tim say that the reactions were awesome?

Epic's PR team doesn't like him inbetween the time he signs their checks I think.

what I'm fearing is coming true as well, those with legit criticisms are being lumped with being a toxic gaming man baby.

Already happening.

I'm trying to take the "Gamer" label back but alas, I'm nothing but a weak fart in hurricane.

 

[Cordelia]

what I'm fearing is coming true as well, those with legit criticisms are being lumped with being a toxic gaming man baby.

Oh yes this is already happened everywhere. If you don't want to use EGS for any reason, you are toxic person who harass devs with death threats. There is no middleground between Pro EGS and toxic PC gaming community who don't want to use another launcher who sent death threats.

 

[madjoki]

what I'm fearing is coming true as well, those with legit criticisms are being lumped with being a toxic gaming man baby.

This is true already. It's impossible to critique EGS.

 

[Acidote]

what I'm fearing is coming true as well, those with legit criticisms are being lumped with being a toxic gaming man baby.

This has annoyed me. Never have I said anything close to an aggresive response or anything even remotely like the things those gamergate people say and do yet if I say anything critical about the EGS I'm thrown into that mass of hate to invalidate my opinion. It's insulting.

 

[Le Pertti]

There it is, the ultimate victim card that makes them off limits. They are now free to fuck everything up as much as they want.

 

[Nabs]

what I'm fearing is coming true as well, those with legit criticisms are being lumped with being a toxic gaming man baby.

Yeah, you'll get called a victim blamer for discussing anything that went on over the last few days. It's over.

 

[Derrick01]

what I'm fearing is coming true as well, those with legit criticisms are being lumped with being a toxic gaming man baby.

It's what happens when you run out of options. Nothing else the media and defenders have tried has worked to stem the anti-EGS tide so they're going into the bag of real dirty tricks now.

They want the good people who are against EGS to be quiet and this is a good (albeit shameful) way to do it. After all you don't want to be associated with the worst of the worst, right? Better be quiet then

 

[NarohDethan]

Also, guys, please. I know we've been guilty of this and I know it can be exasperating but please refrain from discussing other forums here. We really dont want that fame.

 

[uraizen]

But didnt Tim say that the reactions were awesome?

I was about to say that what people are doing is fucked up, but he did say that. I still personally think it's fucked up, but if he revels in this shit then whatever floats your boat.

 

[Knurek]

It's what happens when you run out of options. Nothing else the media and defenders have tried has worked to stem the anti-EGS tide so they're going into the bag of real dirty tricks now.

They want the good people who are against EGS to be quiet and this is a good (albeit shameful) way to do it. After all you don't want to be associated with the worst of the worst, right? Better be quiet then

I genuinely feel Epic can succeed at doing something Microsoft has been trying on and off to do for the past 10 years - kill off enthusiast PC gaming. They sure have managed to kill my enthusiasm...

 

[lashman]

But didnt Tim say that the reactions were awesome?

no, he said the blog post was awesome

 

[AHA-Lambda]

There it is, the ultimate victim card that makes them off limits. They are now free to fuck everything up as much as they want.

Yep, unfortunately I think this whole incident is just going to legitimise the store now.

 

[Chudah]

Yep, unfortunately I think this whole incident is just going to legitimise the store now.

They can legitimize the store all they want, if the devs they moneyhat start releasing mediocre/half-assed games because they no longer need to make quality products because they've already sold enough copies to stay afloat, then less and less people will be buying those games anyway. And I'm gonna be honest, most new game releases over there have a short burst of news output on their release week, but then discussion about it almost completely drops off shortly after because people aren't really reviewing and sharing media of them. If you want people to buy your game long after the release window, you need to keep news of it within their sights. And that's not happening on EGS.

 

[TioChuck]

Epic releasing this statement right after the release of the Patriot Act episode where Timmy is shown to be a moron is pretty funny.

 

[Ge0force]

There it is, the ultimate victim card that makes them off limits. They are now free to fuck everything up as much as they want.

Yeah, everyone is talking about the few morons harassing these devs, ignoring the thousands of people raising their voice against this exclusivity deal in an acceptable way.

Twitter is full of Tweets where people having issues with exclusivity deals are being called toxic children, gamer gators and alt-rights.

Journalists are showing their supports for these poor devs. And the "it's just another store" meme is back in every comments section.

What happens now looks like perfectly planned PR from Epic to silence anyone criticizing their store and exclusivity deals.

What a sad, sad day this is for pc gaming. It seems the exclusivity deals are here to stay.