|OT| Epic vs Apple/Google - Battle of the Tims

Wok

Wok
Oct 30, 2018
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Yes, but it says licensing fee or comission. And a percentage of revenue is basically a type of commission, right?
I don't think Apple could get a percentage of the revenue which would not go through their in-house payment system.

I mean, before one can earn a cut as a percentage of the revenue, they have to know the total revenue. Since this revenue does not go through their payment system, they would have to ask the devs to fill in "tax forms", and there is no way Apple could ensure that devs tell the truth. They don't have the power of government to fight tax evasion. Even if they did, keep in mind governments struggle with tax evasion.
 
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Ascheroth

Chilling in the Megastructure
Nov 12, 2018
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I don't think Apple could get a percentage of the revenue which would not go through their in-house payment system.
I suppose it would shift the money flow from "Apple gets all the money -> pays 70% to dev" to "Dev gets all the money (or a bit less if they use another payment provider) -> reports to Apple that they made X money and pays them based on whatever commission structure is in place".
At least that's something I've seen floating around, I have no idea if this is common and/or working like that in practice, which is why I'll have to wait for Hoeg's take on the entire thing (or someone else who has more understanding of the subject matter and the implications of the finer details of this ruling).

Actually, thinking about it, isn't this how Unreal Engine's licensing/commission works?
 

Wok

Wok
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Actually, thinking about it, isn't this how Unreal Engine's licensing/commission works?
Correct.

I wonder how they can enforce that. I guess they have telemetry to cross-check whether what the devs report is consistent with their stats.

Pretty intrusive.



 
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Wok

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That means Epic knows precisely how much money every successful game built with Unreal Engine earns. Crazy stats!
For a $30 game, that would happen after ~ 30k copies sold.
 

madjoki

đź‘€ I see you
Sep 19, 2018
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That means Epic knows precisely how much money every successful game built with Unreal Engine earns. Crazy stats!
For a $30 game, that would happen after ~ 30k copies sold.
Unless they have custom UE license without those reporting requirements or commission. (AAA developers mainly)
 

Alexandros

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Nov 4, 2018
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A summary of the main takeaways from the ruling:

Apple wins
  • Apple is not an illegal monopolist
  • The relevant market is mobile gaming, not iOS
  • In-app purchases are not a separate product illegally tied to the App Store
  • The walled-garden model does provide pro-consumer security benefits
  • Apple can mandate the use of IAP
  • Apple is entitled to a commission or license fee even if alternative payment methods are used
  • iOS is not an essential facility
  • Android phones, cloud gaming and devices like the Switch and Steam Deck are competing with Apple devices
  • Apple can ban Fortnite, Epic and all of its subsidiaries from the App Store
  • Epic has to pay Apple 30% of the money it made through the direct purchase option

Epic wins
  • Apple can no longer forbid apps from linking to external payment systems or notifying users of alternative payment options
  • The lack of other app stores on iOS does stifle innovation
 

Alexandros

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Epic won so big in the case (according to the media) that Tim felt bad for Apple and is appealing to give it a second chance. What a sweetheart.