Community MetaSteam | July 2021 - Corporate Propaganda

Status
Not open for further replies.

Pogi

illiterate
Jun 25, 2019
165
469
63
Steam deserves that 30% solely for Steam Input. Remember that NBA 2K21 giveaway from Epic? People are launching (including me) the Epic Launcher via Steam in order to make Xbox Series Controller via Bluetooth (apparently for PS controllers too) to work for the game since the game itself does not recognize this controller as Xinput, rebinding the controllers will lock up the game. I know, this is 2k's fault for the garbage that they are, but we really dont appreciate Valve enough in their effort to make PC gaming this easy.
 

hersheyfan

South Sea Islander
Jul 17, 2021
67
218
33
Manila, Philippines
steamcommunity.com
$10 increase in msrp compared to the Kingmaker, 3x increase in regional pricing. Screw this.

It's actually pretty funny seeing all of these pubs (particularly the more niche ones) scurrying to raise their base prices everywhere (based on the percieved success of some high profile examples of the strategy working, like say Capcom).

Do they think what worked for freaking Capcom, of all publishers, will pan out in the same way for them? Not every company can use this strategy and hope to succeed, if you or your games don't have the same cachet people are just going to ignore your output instead of giving it a chance.

I've always thought that wielding good regional pricing as a competitive advantage was a good idea, it helps indie and AA purveyors compete on more equal footing with the big pubs and their marketing budgets. This isn't the move at all... and on Steam, of all places, where there are a LOT of purchase alternatives vying for customer attention.
 

Routa

Non-Stop MMO Searcher
Dec 22, 2018
861
3,797
93
$10 increase in msrp compared to the Kingmaker, 3x increase in regional pricing. Screw this.

Owlcat is Russian too, red everywhere on pricing :blobweary:

Theres a Russian thread where they are frustrated about the price in Russia and a community manager made a post on the forum. Here's the google translated version since original post is in Russian.

First of all, of course, I'm sorry that you had such an impression of the pre-order price, but I can assure you with all certainty that no one “specially for the Russians” overestimated it, as well as for other regions in principle.
Pricing is directly related to the value of the resources invested in production, and since the time when the first game was released, our technical training has increased significantly.
Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous has improved graphics, completely new mechanics have appeared (including such significant ones as the Mythical Path that affect the entire game), we took into account the experience of the first game to make the story as immersive and intense as possible for a minute. , introduced many new classes and much more. We really think we have made a significant step since our “debut” and we are sure that you will feel it too when you learn more about the game.
First line is a little wonky in the translator regarding regional pricing, but looks like won't be any change based on that comment :birbangry:
 
Last edited:

texhnolyze

Child at heart
Oct 19, 2018
3,570
8,509
113
Indonesia
Owlcat is Russian too, red everywhere on pricing :blobweary:

Theres a Russian thread where they are frustrated about the price in Russia and a community manager made a post on the forum. Here's the google translated version since original post is in Russian.
First line is a little wonky in the translator regarding regional pricing, but looks like won't be any change based on that comment :birbangry:
Lol, they really have no clue what they're talking about, aren't they? Yeah sure the game has vastly improved from the original, which is reflected by the $10 price increase. But how does that have anything to do with regional pricing?
 
  • This!
Reactions: lashman

Readher

MetaMember
Jun 23, 2020
396
1,149
93
Poland
I backed Pathfinder: WotR for $24 and bought add-on copies for my friends for $26, which is ~100 PLN. Meanwhile, the game is 180 PLN on Steam. I'd say I made a good choice, 45% cheaper and all.
 

Tizoc

Vile Enabling Uncle
Oct 11, 2018
7,431
18,273
113
34
Oman
ko-fi.com
This should be the first response on any "Steam cut bad" discussion
Majority of a game's purchases are on Steam however, so the dev/pub would be losing that 30% on a purchase more than them getting a higher cut on their game being sold.

Furthermore purchases of a game on steam, has its reviews counted for the overall rating of the game. Redeeming a game's key and then writing a review of it will not have that review count. This is a reason why some devs recommend buying directly from steam, which in turn means losing on 30% of the cut..

Adding to point #2: Hardly anyone here uses GMG, Humble, or any other key selling site's top sellers list as a metric; we use Steam's top sellers list both global and on the main site.
 

Tomasety

MetaSadMember
Jun 8, 2020
717
2,559
93
$10 increase in msrp compared to the Kingmaker, 3x increase in regional pricing. Screw this.

I saw that a few days ago and I can add two pieces of information regarding regional pricing.

Before the game went up to pre order on Steam you could simply pre-order the game on Owlcat website for mere 30$ per copy. An extra copy had an additional discount applied to the price, can't remember if it became 25$ per additional copy. I don't think Owlcats offered any kind of regional pricing, I think there was a worlwide price parity starting at 30$.

Regarding their regional pricing on Steam store, they were going to self publish the game but a few weeks ago they suddenly changed their minds (I assume they were in a bad financial status) and the new Koch Media publishing brand made a deal with them; Meta Publishing. Unfortunately we won't ever know if they had planned this regional pricing should they have kept the game self-publish

My personal opinion; unless you were a backer I would advice people to wait a few months after release to get the game on their hands. I have the feeling the game will have a rough launch.
 
Last edited:
  • This!
Reactions: Panda Pedinte

Tizoc

Vile Enabling Uncle
Oct 11, 2018
7,431
18,273
113
34
Oman
ko-fi.com
Not to mention Steam's 30% cut can drop down to 25/20% upon reaching a threshold. Either way, the 30% cut is the industry standard, so I'm not sure why Valve gets all the slack for it.
Not all game devs can even REACH that threshold you're talking about, so it doesn't mean much. At best it is major publishers like Capcom, MS, etc. along with popular indie devs (creators of Hades, creators of Don't starve, as an example) that can reach that milestone and from afterwards get a smaller cut on purchase of their game on steam. Smaller and medium sized indies couldn't reach that milestone on steam for years.
Furthermore this milestone, it would be for total revenue/sales on STEAM, why would valve consider the revenue the dev or pub earned from purchasing or redeeming a key?
 

Mivey

MeatMember
Sep 20, 2018
1,963
5,951
113
Not all game devs can even REACH that threshold you're talking about, so it doesn't mean much. At best it is major publishers like Capcom, MS, etc. along with popular indie devs (creators of Hades, creators of Don't starve, as an example) that can reach that milestone and from afterwards get a smaller cut on purchase of their game on steam. Smaller and medium sized indies couldn't reach that milestone on steam for years.
Furthermore this milestone, it would be for total revenue/sales on STEAM, why would valve consider the revenue the dev or pub earned from purchasing or redeeming a key?
I could see Valve opting for something similar to what Apple has done, where the first million in revenue has a lower cut. Of course the question is how much this would cut into Valve's bottom end. If most of the revenue on Steam comes from bigger titles anyway, then it might not hurt them at all. If instead small indies are actually a big driver of income, then this would be harder for Valve to justify.
 

Ascheroth

Chilling in the Megastructure
Nov 12, 2018
3,717
8,874
113
Not to mention Steam's 30% cut can drop down to 25/20% upon reaching a threshold. Either way, the 30% cut is the industry standard, so I'm not sure why Valve gets all the slack for it.
Don't want to burn the bridges with console makers cause if they react, you have no alternatives. PC is open so even if Valve were to throw you off Steam (they won't) you could still sell your stuff elsewhere.
Also consoles (at least Sony) are very "manual" whereas Valve automates most of it. Algorithms and automatisms don't care about what you write on Twitter, but step on i.e. Sony's toes and maybe you won't be "invited" to a sale next time or not get that marketing deal.
 

boop beep

boo
Dec 6, 2018
1,784
3,546
113
I could see Valve opting for something similar to what Apple has done, where the first million in revenue has a lower cut. Of course the question is how much this would cut into Valve's bottom end. If most of the revenue on Steam comes from bigger titles anyway, then it might not hurt them at all. If instead small indies are actually a big driver of income, then this would be harder for Valve to justify.
I'd like to see something along these lines. It would really benefit smaller games. As much as I like seeing EA and Microsoft on Steam, it's what I'd have preferred they did instead of catering to the the big publishers. It's just disproportionate the way it is now.
 

Tizoc

Vile Enabling Uncle
Oct 11, 2018
7,431
18,273
113
34
Oman
ko-fi.com
I could see Valve opting for something similar to what Apple has done, where the first million in revenue has a lower cut. Of course the question is how much this would cut into Valve's bottom end.
Valve's bottom line seems fine from we're able to see though-


^Global Top Sellers, look it up yourself and you ought to see similar list.

Considering the volume of sales that happen on steam on a regular basis, I don't think there should be much concern on its bottom line.
Indeed a more lenient early period of release would be welcome. I keep looking at the volume of sales that go on on the store on a day to day basis and find that valve could have the cut to be lower somehow.

If most of the revenue on Steam comes from bigger titles anyway, then it might not hurt them at all. If instead small indies are actually a big driver of income, then this would be harder for Valve to justify.
Indies have been on steam for the better part of a decade, and not all of them are major sellers, so as to be viewed as a bigger title. This comes off as saying 'if small indie devs work hard they'll surely be rewarded', which is ludicrous to say the least.
 

Kyougar

No reviews, no Buy
Nov 2, 2018
1,237
4,158
113
Not all game devs can even REACH that threshold you're talking about, so it doesn't mean much. At best it is major publishers like Capcom, MS, etc. along with popular indie devs (creators of Hades, creators of Don't starve, as an example) that can reach that milestone and from afterwards get a smaller cut on purchase of their game on steam. Smaller and medium sized indies couldn't reach that milestone on steam for years.
Furthermore this milestone, it would be for total revenue/sales on STEAM, why would valve consider the revenue the dev or pub earned from purchasing or redeeming a key?
This argument that a lower cut for major successes is bad and the little guys should get the lower cut instead doesn't solve the issue for failing projects AT ALL.

First of all: Someone that needs 5 or 10% more to survive is quite rare in the first place. Either you are profitable with a 30% cut or your game tanks and those 5 to 10% wouldn't help you anyway.
Second: Learn to budget correctly! 30% is a known "expense"! Sure, you can't really know beforehand if your game is a hit or not, but you can budget your project that it will have a certain range that it would realistically and historically sell (if you have existing games/series or experience making games) or this is your first project and there was no guarantee that it will make money at all.
Third: WHO IN THE HELL is budgeting their games so precisely that they would be bankrupt at 30% and profitable at 20%??? And if you know that in the first place, then cut the expenses beforehand, because you know that you have a 30% commission!
Fourth: Even if the Industry standard gets down to 20% Most bigger companies will just pocket the difference and smaller devs and indies will just pump more money into the game because they think they have 10% more cash after selling the game. Now we have the situation that 20% is too much.


Sorry if this comes across a little aggressive, but the little guys versus the big guys narrative is bullshit. Several AAA Studios don't get 20% while small indies get it (Valhalla and Among us just recently)
Not size matters, but success.
 

kafiend

MetaMember
Dec 6, 2018
368
964
93
Publishers can set their prices to whatever they want, it does not change the amount of money I can reasonably spend on gaming entertainment without causing hardship in other areas of my life. It just means less games for my money.

Which means the outcome is less gaming entertainment, leading to less interest and more alternative ways of spending my time than games.

Now, if I had better value* for my money then we can talk about me putting more money in there.

* Value is not GAAS - please fuck off with that.
 

Arc

MetaMember
Sep 19, 2020
728
2,377
93
I personally believe strongly that if Valve were to lower their cut substantially then the average price I'd need to pay for new games would go up.
Yeah I don't think I would have got Monster Hunter Stories 2 for $48 or Humankind for $40 from Humble Bundle if Valve went to 12%. They would almost certainly have to put major restrictions on third party sites.
 

fantomena

MetaMember
Dec 17, 2018
6,920
16,744
113
Im just gonna say that the reason I don't really participate in the dev/pub cut discussion anywhere is because I don't care about it at all. I never think about it when buying games aka "hmm.. im gonna get this indie game on itchio or egs because of the higher dev/pub cut" is never in my brain.

I only care about what place where I buy stuff get's me most value.

If Epic releases a new feature that would be perfect for my needs tommorrow I would start buying from EGS.
 

prudis

anime occult member
Sep 19, 2018
8,332
19,644
113
The Kingdom of Beer and Porn
twitter.com
Im just gonna say that the reason I don't really participate in the dev/pub cut discussion anywhere is because I don't care about it at all. I never think about it when buying games aka "hmm.. im gonna get this indie game on itchio or egs because of the higher dev/pub cut" is never in my brain.

I only care about what place where I buy stuff get's me most value.
pretty much this

If Epic releases a new feature that would be perfect for my needs tommorrow I would start buying from EGS.
this on other hand i dont see what it would need be to convince me to trust them ever again
 
Last edited:

fantomena

MetaMember
Dec 17, 2018
6,920
16,744
113
lashman I see your dissaporval emoji in my post and I assume it's because of the EGS part.

I don't understand your reaction, honestly. I've always stated that I would buy in places that serves my needs the most.
 
  • This!
  • Like
Reactions: Lashley and Wok
OP
lashman

lashman

Dead & Forgotten
Sep 5, 2018
22,966
56,536
113
lashman I see your dissaporval emoji in my post and I assume it's because of the EGS part.

I don't understand your reaction, honestly. I've always stated that I would buy in places that serves my needs the most.
i would too ... but not after all the bullshit they've done (and continue to do) ...

there's a BIG difference here
 

Kvik

Crossbell City Councillor
Dec 6, 2018
2,983
6,871
113
Downunder.
What the hell, man. :mion_angery:

Issues fixed by this restoration patch include:
  • Music that sounds too quiet, even if you turn it up
  • Music that sounds muffled, with certain instruments being harder to hear
  • General audible compression artifacts
 

fantomena

MetaMember
Dec 17, 2018
6,920
16,744
113
i would too ... but not after all the bullshit they've done (and continue to do) ...

there's a BIG difference here
I understand that, however the shop that serves my needs the best is the palce I always will buy from.

Like I buy certain older games on GOG even if they are on Steam too because GOG version is most of the time fixed more than the Steam version (usually by the GOG staff themself), so buying certain older games from Steam would give me the inferior version.
 
OP
lashman

lashman

Dead & Forgotten
Sep 5, 2018
22,966
56,536
113
I understand that, however the shop that serves my needs the best is the palce I always will buy from.

Like I buy certain older games on GOG even if they are on Steam too because GOG version is most of the time fixed more than the Steam version (usually by the GOG staff themself), so buying certain older games from Steam would give me the inferior version.
i have no problem with using gog ... or origin ... or even udontplay (even though i refuse to use it, but that's on me) .... or almost any other store really

but i do have a HUGE FUCKING PROBLEM with egs
 

fantomena

MetaMember
Dec 17, 2018
6,920
16,744
113
i have no problem with gog ... or origin ... or even udontplay (even though i refuse to use it, but that's on me) ....

but i do have a HUGE FUCKING PROBLEM with egs
I have big problems with Origin, I actually uninstalled Origin yesterday because Origin is terrible. Well, case in point:

Im installing a few games on Origin to see if Im still interested in playing them as Im considering to uninstall Origin, as in games like Syndicate, MoH Warfighter, games that EA didn't bother to put anywhere else or that I don't own on Steam and has too high price on Steam (NFS 2015).

Holy shit Origin is still so bad, laggy, slow, jusat awful all around. I also don't have EA Desktop App installed because that thing also sucks a lot.
 
  • Eyes
Reactions: Tomasety

Gintaro

Junior Member
Feb 20, 2021
142
351
63
Malaysia
What the hell, man. :mion_angery:



I thought it's my PC that's the issue with the music volume haha. Gonna try the mod and see does it work. Thanks for the info! :cat-heart-blob: There's also a 60 fps mod for the game too. Haven't face any issue using it on my part

First reply of this discussion
 

ezodagrom

JELLYBEE
Nov 2, 2018
623
1,133
93
Portugal
www.youtube.com
What the hell, man. :mion_angery:

There's also a mod to make the game run at arbitrary framerates, though it's not 100% perfect, it also makes the cursor move faster.
The creator of the mod said that they'll try to fix the cursor speed issue tomorrow.


EDIT: Ah, I was too slow.
 

Joe Spangle

Playing Mad Max
Apr 17, 2019
1,764
5,673
113
I'd much rather give my money to Volvo than any other player in the gaming industry as they have proven that they do more with it for me, the customer. Dont really care about devs or publishers, If they want me to buy their game it needs to be on Steam because Steam is the service i trust and have the least problems with. If thats not worth 30% then sell it somewhere else.
 

fantomena

MetaMember
Dec 17, 2018
6,920
16,744
113
I'd much rather give my money to Volvo than any other player in the gaming industry as they have proven that they do more with it for me, the customer. Dont really care about devs or publishers, If they want me to buy their game it needs to be on Steam because Steam is the service i trust and have the least problems with. If thats not worth 30% then sell it somewhere else.
holy shit are you me
 

texhnolyze

Child at heart
Oct 19, 2018
3,570
8,509
113
Indonesia
Publishers can set their prices to whatever they want, it does not change the amount of money I can reasonably spend on gaming entertainment without causing hardship in other areas of my life. It just means less games for my money.

Which means the outcome is less gaming entertainment, leading to less interest and more alternative ways of spending my time than games.

Now, if I had better value* for my money then we can talk about me putting more money in there.

* Value is not GAAS - please fuck off with that.
Indeed. These publishers act like we can't live without their games. Hah.
 

Ascheroth

Chilling in the Megastructure
Nov 12, 2018
3,717
8,874
113
The Ascent on Gamepass.
Halo Infinite week end.
Death Door and Avengers discounted to respectable levels.
...
Me playing FF14 : how the fuck will I find the time to play any of those if I buy them ? :sweaty-blob:
I still need to do the last chapter in Ys 9 before I get back to the other long games I already bought and started, but I've mostly been playing Genshin since the new region dropped, and Punishing: Gray Raven on the side :grimacing-face:
And then next week potentially has me get more games from Choice, lol.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Li Kao

fantomena

MetaMember
Dec 17, 2018
6,920
16,744
113
The Ascent on Gamepass.
Halo Infinite week end.
Death Door and Avengers discounted to respectable levels.
...
Me playing FF14 : how the fuck will I find the time to play any of those if I buy them ? :sweaty-blob:
Focus on playing the games that have a deadline, meaning Avengers and Halo.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tomasety and Li Kao
I'd much rather give my money to Volvo than any other player in the gaming industry as they have proven that they do more with it for me, the customer. Dont really care about devs or publishers, If they want me to buy their game it needs to be on Steam because Steam is the service i trust and have the least problems with. If thats not worth 30% then sell it somewhere else.
Also agree 100% with all of this
 
Status
Not open for further replies.