Community The MetaVerse VR thread (hardware/software/etc, all platforms)

[Mor]

It ain't cheap by any means, 1080€ for me will be a hell of money dropping on VR, I don't know if I will buy it NOW, but damn, it sounds exciting, I really want to buy it and play with it but I need to think about it and make some numbers first.

Asides from that, exciting to see that the first one of the VR games is coming this year.

 

[「Echo」]

It looks awesome!

I do have a question though. If I am only interested in VR games where you sit rather than wander around your room, do I need the "stations" or can I just the HMD?

 

[Alextended]

You need the stations regardless, the only reason to sell bundles without them is for people who have base stations from the HTC Vive which are compatible. Otherwise the HMD would just be a stereoscopic 3D display with nothing tracking your looking/leaning around (and I doubt it lets you even try that at all).

 

[「Echo」]

Oh, I'm used to PSVR where you just used the Camera to track your head.

Ah well. Guess I'll have to get the stations as well then.

 

[Durante]

Significantly more expensive than I expected!

At those prices I'll probably just get the controllers.

If the displays were OLED (and kept the 120 / 144 Hz, which is very intriguing) I probably couldn't resist the HMD+ controller package, but as is I absolutely can.

 

[「Echo」]

Significantly more expensive than I expected!

At those prices I'll probably just get the controllers.

If the displays were OLED (and kept the 120 / 144 Hz, which is very intriguing) I probably couldn't resist the HMD+ controller package, but as is I absolutely can.

At least according to this page, the headset does have a native 120 rate, and experimental 144.

The headset's dual 1440x1600 RGB LCDs provide 50% more subpixels than OLED, resulting in greater sharpness for the same rendering cost. In addition, the fill-factor is three times better than OLED, greatly reducing “screen door” effect. The Valve Index Headset runs at 120Hz with full back-compatibility to 90Hz, as well as an experimental 144Hz mode. Higher framerates improve realism and optical comfort, allowing longer and more comfortable play sessions. Valve Index displays have a reduced illumination period of 0.330ms to 0.530ms (framerate dependent), allowing imagery to remain just as sharp when your head is in motion as when you're standing still. This is a 5x improvement over first-generation PC VR HMDs.

Headset - Valve Index® - Upgrade your experience - Valve Corporation

Fidelity first.

www.valvesoftware.com

 

[Durante]

At least according to this page, the headset does have a native 120 rate, and experimental 144.

Yes, with the LPLCD panels they are using.

What I meant is that if it had that feature and was using OLED panels I'd be very tempted by the HMD.

 

[「Echo」]

Yes, with the LPLCD panels they are using.

What I meant is that if it had that feature and was using OLED panels I'd be very tempted by the HMD.

ahhhhh, I see. Sorry for misunderstanding. orz

 

[Delusi]

It's a Vive Pro killer. The problem is that the rest of the market is heading towards cheaper, self-contained solutions, and the Index is not that.

 

[d00d3n]

I guess the base station upgrade is mainly for people who want a larger play area?

 

[helloCLD]

$999 is a little more than I expected, but not by much. What I find most appealing about it over the Rift S/Quest is it seems more developer friendly. With Linux support, incoming source code examples for working with the frunk and onboard cameras, and supposedly a big focus on comfort, I think that's all worth the extra cash.

 

[Durante]

This is very nice to have:
store.steampowered.com/app/1072830/VirtualLink_USBC_Adapter_for_Valve_Index_Headset

(had to remove the http since the embedding messes up)

 

[crimsonheadGCN]

The price is higher than I expected, but I'll be getting it. I think this would make for an awesome Christmas gift for myself.

 

[low-G]

Not thrilled with Index but if my Oculus Rift breaks and I can't get it fixed I'll buy one of those over a Rift S (pending impressions & reviews)... Doesn't have any of my dream features (being able to toss my corrective lenses via some complex optics for example), and stepping down to LCD...

It's a shame that Valve couldn't have some future Valve software to show off at the same time. That's still what I'm waiting for.

 

[SRossi]

This is very nice to have:
store.steampowered.com/app/1072830/VirtualLink_USBC_Adapter_for_Valve_Index_Headset

oh, that's great. would be good if it was included in the full set.

 

[BlueOdin]

As someone who wanted to get into VR this year the Index is way out of my budget though I'm probably not the target market for it.

The Index Controller sound great though. As someone intersted is Samsung Odyssey+ and the Index Controllers a good starter combination?

 

[SRossi]

The Index Controller sound great though. As someone intersted is Samsung Odyssey+ and the Index Controllers a good starter combination?

you would also need 2 basestations if you want to use the vive or index controllers; and then it's not a out of the box experience but you have to use pushrax/OpenVR-SpaceCalibrator afaik.

 

[BlueOdin]

you would also need 2 basestations if you want to use the vive or index controllers; and then it's not a out of the box experience but you have to use pushrax/OpenVR-SpaceCalibrator afaik.

My dream is dead

 

[Arulan]

It's more expensive than I was anticipating, but what I've seen so far looks really good. I might have to wait until end of year, but I'll be picking it up for sure. The upgrade paths available within the family of SteamVR hardware is really appreciated too.

I've seen some complaints about base stations on other forums, but I wouldn't have it any other way. Lighthouse tracking is phenomenal. Tracking is perhaps the last thing I'd want to compromise on. And I don't know about everyone else, but I have an area that I can use for VR. Taking it to another area of my house would be pointless.

 

[Alextended]

Valve Index Hands-On: Steam’s Big Upgrade From Vive Takes A Crowbar To Rift S

I didn’t know the distance between the pupils of my eyes, but as I moved a slider on the bottom of the Valve Index head-mounted display from one extreme to the other I found it within seconds. Between 67 and 68 millimeters, the visuals delivered by Index seemed to

uploadvr.com

Hands-on: Valve's Index Headset Sets an Impressive New Bar for VR Fidelity

Valve has finally given Index a full reveal and has announced that the headset will be available for pre-order starting tomorrow and is due to ship by the end of June. We recently visited Valve’s offices for a hands-on with Index, which the company hopes will set the bar for VR fidelity. After...

www.roadtovr.com

Hands-on With Valve Index: VR Passion Redefined - GMW3

Valve doesn't care about entry level, Index is for the enthusiast.

www.vrfocus.com

All good stuff but really for that price nobody should expect anything less! It'd only be truly impressive if the cost was lower to be honest. Hope it gets there!

 

[Alextended]

HTC trying to entice Rift users to use their store.

VIVEPORT GIVEAWAY | For Oculus Rift

www.campaign.viveport.com

 

[Durante]

It's more expensive than I was anticipating, but what I've seen so far looks really good. I might have to wait until end of year, but I'll be picking it up for sure. The upgrade paths available within the family of SteamVR hardware is really appreciated too.

I've seen some complaints about base stations on other forums, but I wouldn't have it any other way. Lighthouse tracking is phenomenal. Tracking is perhaps the last thing I'd want to compromise on. And I don't know about everyone else, but I have an area that I can use for VR. Taking it to another area of my house would be pointless.

I completely agree. There are already a lot of headsets to chose from in the WMR family that compromise on tracking quality.

 

[EdwardTivrusky]

I can afford it but it'd wipe out a few months savings so i don't know if i want to go for it or not. I need to read up on compatibility with Vive and maybe go controllers only for a bit before getting headset/lighthouses. I take it they are v2 lighthouses?

Decisions, decisions.

 

[Durante]

They are V2 lighthouses, but they aren't necessary if you have V1 lighthouses (and not really a meaningful upgrade unless you have a massive playspace).

 

[Joe Spangle]

They are V2 lighthouses, but they aren't necessary if you have V1 lighthouses (and not really a meaningful upgrade unless you have a massive playspace).

Yeah this is true for me, I have a Vive and my playspace is about at the limit for the recommended area.. im thinking of at least getting the controllers and may well pick up the headset as well as it sounds like a bit of an improvement over the Vive HMD.

 

[EdwardTivrusky]

They are V2 lighthouses, but they aren't necessary if you have V1 lighthouses (and not really a meaningful upgrade unless you have a massive playspace).

Oh, I'm only able to do Standing/Sitting games so i may look to just get the controllers... and the headset. I'm weak.

 

[Alextended]

Yay, Boneworks devs are going the extra mile to properly support non-Index controllers like Oculus Touch, not just lump them all together like Vive wands.

 

[crimsonheadGCN]

Only another hour and 13 minutes till Index is up for preorder. I kinda hope that Valve does something similar to what Amazon does and give you an option to pay in monthly installments without a credit check and interest.

 

[low-G]

Yay, Boneworks devs are going the extra mile to properly support non-Index controllers like Oculus Touch, not just lump them all together like Vive wands.

I figured of all the games that would handle this right they would. Very glad they're doing their due diligence. Part of the reason I'm not dying for Index wands.

 

[lashman]

Only another hour and 13 minutes till Index is up for preorder. I kinda hope that Valve does something similar to what Amazon does and give you an option to pay in monthly installments without a credit check and interest.

i wish ... but that's not going to happen ... sadly

 

[「Echo」]

As someone who is used to just PSVR, where a camera tracks the lights emitting from the HMD to track your head... how do the "Stations" work exactly? If I only have two, where do I place them? One in front and one in back? How do they track the HMD?

Before I was told I needed the "Stations" even for just sitting games I thought the HMD had like gyro's and stuff but I guess not.

Totally ignorant but genuinely curious.

 

[Joe Spangle]

As someone who is used to just PSVR, where a camera tracks the lights emitting from the HMD to track your head... how do the "Stations" work exactly? If I only have two, where do I place them? One in front and one in back? How do they track the HMD?

Before I was told I needed the "Stations" even for just sitting games I thought the HMD had like gyro's and stuff but I guess not.

Totally ignorant but genuinely curious.

They go in opposite corners of your play space.

I think for sitting games with just head tracking you only need one that is able to see you.

 

[SRossi]

As someone who is used to just PSVR, where a camera tracks the lights emitting from the HMD to track your head... how do the "Stations" work exactly? If I only have two, where do I place them? One in front and one in back? How do they track the HMD?

Before I was told I needed the "Stations" even for just sitting games I thought the HMD had like gyro's and stuff but I guess not.

Totally ignorant but genuinely curious.

basically the lighthouses sweep the room with laser light and are tracking where the hmd and controllers (or any tracked object) are in the room relative to their positioning. the hmd itself still has gyro and stuff

Welcome to Steamworks

 

[EdwardTivrusky]

As someone who is used to just PSVR, where a camera tracks the lights emitting from the HMD to track your head... how do the "Stations" work exactly? If I only have two, where do I place them? One in front and one in back? How do they track the HMD?

Before I was told I needed the "Stations" even for just sitting games I thought the HMD had like gyro's and stuff but I guess not.

Totally ignorant but genuinely curious.

The BaseStations go diagonally opposite each other as far into the corner of your playarea as they can, up high and angled down a bit. Essentially they splay the area in front of them with a beam which is picked up and used for positioning. I have mine on "Decorator Stands" or Lightweight Acro-Stands as they are sturdier than a tripod and have a smaller footprint.

 

[Joe Spangle]

I have mine on "Decorator Stands" or Lightweight Acro-Stands.

Yeah same for me. I fixed one to the top of a bookcase and the other is on a decorator stand. I have just about enough space in my flat for full roomscale.

 

[「Echo」]

They go in opposite corners of your play space.

I think for sitting games with just head tracking you only need one that is able to see you.

basically the lighthouses sweep the room with laser light and are tracking where the hmd and controllers (or any tracked object) are in the room relative to their positioning. the hmd itself still has gyro and stuff

Welcome to Steamworks

The BaseStations go diagonally opposite each other as far into the corner of your playarea as they can, up high and angled down a bit. Essentially they splay the area in front of them with a beam which is picked up and used for positioning. I have mine on "Decorator Stands" or Lightweight Acro-Stands as they are sturdier than a tripod and have a smaller footprint.

Thanks all! At first it seemed quite advanced, but actually it's quite amazing how Valve made it so simple as detailed here:

This Is How Valve’s Amazing Lighthouse Tracking Technology Works

Valve’s virtual reality demo at GDC was nothing short of magical—it used fancy emitter technology to let us actually walk around a demo room. It felt so real. Valve calls the tech Lighthouse, and it’s kind of genius.

gizmodo.com

It's also quite amazing how Valve went through all the trouble of making it and then freely shares it with anybody who wants to build it.

Went lookin' for some articles after my post to see if any had dived into the heart of the tech and sure enough...

 

[lashman]

It's also quite amazing how Valve went through all the trouble of making it and then freely shares it with anybody who wants to build it.

... otherwise known as "sitting on their lazy asses and not doing absolutely anything with those mountains of cash they've got"

 

[「Echo」]

... otherwise known as "sitting on their lazy asses and not doing absolutely anything with those mountains of cash they've got"

I despise when people say this. Even if it comes from ignorance rather than malice, it's just so ridiculous. Valve makes all these cool advancements and tech and freely shares them with everyone regardless of platform or industry. Even beyond the VR stuff.

And everytime you try and explain this stuff to people they try and clap-back with the "but what about muh games" bullshit.

 

[crimsonheadGCN]

Valve Index is available to preorder:

Valve Index

 

[fantomena]

Does not ship to Norway.

God. Wtf Valve?

 

[SRossi]

first errors but now i managed to preorder it and the virtuallink adapter. yay

 

[「Echo」]

Does not ship to Norway.

God. Wtf Valve?

Oh hankenta was telling me about this in the Steam thread. Apparently Valve won't ship anything to Norway, not even Steam controllers or Steam Links.

Very weird indeed.

 

[Alextended]

I just got Apex Construct. It's a nicer game than I thought, I should have given it a shot earlier. The interactions with objects and computers (with actual typing or a simplified touch system as an option) and stuff are pretty good, the bow combat is decent (not like In Death's but still okay), the story and set up immerses you well enough as you do bite sized missions to achieve certain objectives in areas then visit them again later to do something more with more parts accessible because in the mean time you got a higher level key card or the electric arrows that allow you to jump start switches and stuff or whatever else.

It doesn't do a great job of making it feel as organic as it could have been. Like you don't just choose to go to a given area and do new stuff there which you couldn't before, you have to actually pick a new mission from your home map with the new stuff objective in that same area, if you pick the very first mission to that area from the list instead it will just be a repeat of that first visit, the new stuff you acquired since won't be applicable. So it doesn't feel like as much of a continuous journey when basically just some menu/map changes would have allowed it to do that far more convincingly.

But overall it's decent enough in making this feel like an adventure. I dunno why I had such a bad impression of this, maybe because it seemed every other game was an archery game at one point. I only have minor complaints like the limited inventory being shared between usable stuff and secrets/decorations you can find in the missions and bring to your home, or having no quick way to switch arrow types mid-combat, you have to open the inventory, etc. You also some times get a little bit stuck on the scenery and fall back to using teleportation (as well as having no jump and other moves so again you just teleport when you need to climb or whatever, it seems the game was designed for teleportation first then they added free locomotion, but most of the time it works).



It also looks really pretty and the art style helps hide deficiencies of cheaper/older VR HMD like mine that are either too low resolution or show godrays etc.

 

[Durante]

Apex construct is great! One of the best "indie" story-driven campaign-based VR-only games IMHO.
I agree with the criticism of not being organic w.r.t to mission ordering and revisits.

Also, it seems the Index is sold out in the US.

 

[Alextended]

Yeah, it's great and VR is in need of more such single player campaigns, I wish Onward and Blade & Sorcery and such games had proper single player.

Here's a video about the just announced (but previously known) Pimax Index-like controllers.


They kinda look like a hybrid between Index and Touch and can do finger tracking also.

There are editions with and without finger tracking, with the former having a choice between trackpad or analog stick and the latter having both like Index.

En Garde: Pimax Unveils Sword Sense VR Controllers With Finger Tracking

Pimax plans to offer two versions of its next-gen VR controllers, dubbed Sword and Sword Sense. They plan to release them in the second half of 2019.

www.tomshardware.com

I'm surprised they have a low-end edition at all given Pimax high end focus. I wonder if that means the price disparity is huge. Touch-like controllers with Index style straps on top could be great even without the finger tracking, Touch controllers are already great even without the ability to "let go" of them. We'll see.

 

[Durante]

I mean, due to the interoperability of Steam the only way Pimax can realistically make people buy their controllers is if they are cheaper -- I don't think they can build something "better" than the Index controllers (or even as good, honestly).
On the HMD side they have the FoV as their unique selling point, but not on the controller side.

 

[Alextended]

Well I can see people who own Pimax and are happy with it going for the same brand controllers too even if they're similarly priced to Index (and they may be, if they go to the lengths of having the basic edition then price disparity between them is probably large and I don't see the base controllers being cheaper than Oculus $100 range). Something to keep profiting from their own fans rather than to attract users who don't own a Pimax HMD to have any brand loyalty to them.

 

[BernardoOne]

Index is too rich for my blood . I will wait for impressions on how well the Knuckles work with the standard Vive and pick just them if they work well.

 

[Alextended]

Facebook Shows Off High Quality Realtime Body Tracking - UploadVR


I wonder if it can track my muscles under the fat, I know I can't

 

[Nzyme]

Seems I'm all in on Index. Looking forward to finally having my own headset that I can use whenever. Lots of games I've been saving to play!