|OT| Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night - Igavania Returns!!

[Parsnip]

I have had one headless Mirian freeze and had that "can't jump out of water" bug happen once as well, so not too bad.

Yeah the hint system is shit but I didn't really need it. Typically you just go where you haven't gone yet and use the new ability you just got from a boss to get there. That's pretty much the game.
Farming for that one shard is the one exception, I also had to look that up.

 

[OSatan]

This game continues to be soo good and so perfect, I just want to keep playing smooth as hell game.

I don't know if the swiming powerup is downright evil or a remainder of how this games are supposed to be.

The bad ending is too easy to trigger tho, an up instead of a right and I was there.

 

[Wibblewozzer]

So after killing Bloodless, I went through and cleared the entire area under the fountain. So I'm stuck again. Look up the solution on YT, and I LAUGH OUT LOUD.

Ok, instead of collecting an item, I am farming a specific shard from a specific enemy

LOL, I would have had ZERO chance of figuring that out on my own.

That's one of the methods of progression that I've considered fairly poor. I spoke around it in Discord to Derrick stating it's somewhat a matter of luck. I'm guessing the shopkeeper might eventually give a solid hint in that direction, too? This step and what to do after you get your picture taken are two of the weakest steps for progression in the game.

 

[Parsnip]

And done.
99.90% map completion, missing one secret room somewhere. I bet it's somewhere close to the beginning, before you get the familiar that points that stuff out.
Bunch of grindy achievements to go, but I don't think I'm going to do them.

 

[QFNS]

Mmm I just caught a hard crash to desktop. Bummer.

Game has been solid for me so far. Except for it annoyingly not remembering which monitor I want it to open on when every other game figured it out without help. Still sad that I lost a bit of progress but I want too terribly far away for a save.

 

[beep boop]

It's hard to pick out a point where my enjoyment of the game took a nosedive. But it's definitely at rock bottom now after opening up the path to the "real" ending. So odd. I enjoyed it a lot despite some minor quirks and then at some point frustration built up and up. The game's alright. I probably have more negative than positive things to say about it, but at its core it's an okay game. I can see what people like about it. The stuff that I disliked must just outweigh that.

 

[Phoenix RISING]

It's hard to pick out a point where my enjoyment of the game took a nosedive. But it's definitely at rock bottom now after opening up the path to the "real" ending. So odd. I enjoyed it a lot despite some minor quirks and then at some point frustration built up and up. The game's alright. I probably have more negative than positive things to say about it, but at its core it's an okay game. I can see what people like about it. The stuff that I disliked must just outweigh that.

The whole "fight me like your life depended on it" boss is a perplexing tonal shift in the story, even if it's appropriate with the area that precedes it.

It's also effing hard, lol. Both the area and the boss fight.

But yeah, those were the two that arrest the momentum, jarring me out of my experience.

 

[Panda Pedinte]

I'm loving Bloodstained so far! For the past few days it was the only game I played. I'm going in totally blind and discovering what I need to do makes me feel like the smartest person alive .

All the nods it does to SoTN are so nice.

 

[OSatan]

Me: It's a shame this game is about to end.
Bloodstained: Here have 3 more areas...

 

[Phoenix RISING]

I would have enjoyed the last area if I had a more powerful weapon.

 

[Amzin]

I'm not totally sure I agree with everyone about the "easy" sentiment. The gear upgrades are few and far between so far, and it is really easy to get into a bad spot and lose half your health in a single room. Healing is basically save rooms (not super frequent) or potions or food, the resources for which are also not common. The area I just got to which is the next for the story, there are things that do literally 1/5 my health in a single shot, and I have gone back to re-explore areas a few times.

I think there's some better gear I could make if I go target farm a few areas but it's
A) a PITA to track down what you need
B) not a big upgrade and
C) a lot of the stuff that is in my list now doesn't even drop yet

Both the previous two bosses were kind of BS too, extremely short or no tells on attacks that you HAVE to be in the right spot to react to or you eat a bunch of damage.

The game is still alright but the lack of refinement is starting to show pretty heavily. It just isn't flowing like these games usually do. Also, it feels really linear - a new movement ability typically unlocks the next region and like 1 previously inaccessible chest or room somewhere far away (also, most of them are not useful outside of their gimmick navigation). And since you only need the drops from the newest enemies to upgrade your gear, or the very weakest ones to make potions, the incentive to explore just is not very high until I get every option.

So far it is about a 6.5/10 for me, especially with whatever the initial input lag nonsense is (why is that needed at all? Why is it not on by default? I have 144fps with everything maxed and that off, why do I have lag at all? How many people are going to have a negative initial impression because of that?). It's not terrible but it screams to be fixed up.

Edit: I forgot, I just had a bug where I was TRYING to farm a new enemy to see what it dropped and after 20+ kills it hadn't dropped anything or its' shard, so I gave up. It was clearly bugged somehow. Enemies in the next room were dropping things like usual.

It's hard to pick out a point where my enjoyment of the game took a nosedive. But it's definitely at rock bottom now after opening up the path to the "real" ending. So odd. I enjoyed it a lot despite some minor quirks and then at some point frustration built up and up. The game's alright. I probably have more negative than positive things to say about it, but at its core it's an okay game. I can see what people like about it. The stuff that I disliked must just outweigh that.

I'm not sure if I'm even up to where you're talking about, but I think your sentiment matches mine - the longer the game goes on the more frustrating it is becoming. I feel like it might be more fun if I had like 20 times (not exaggerating) as much money so I could actually buy some ingredients or items. Or if the pool of drops was smaller and some were shared across enemies. Or if some of the enemies / rooms weren't designed with frustration as the only possible goal

 

[beep boop]

I'm not sure if I'm even up to where you're talking about, but I think your sentiment matches mine - the longer the game goes on the more frustrating it is becoming. I feel like it might be more fun if I had like 20 times (not exaggerating) as much money so I could actually buy some ingredients or items. Or if the pool of drops was smaller and some were shared across enemies. Or if some of the enemies / rooms weren't designed with frustration as the only possible goal

I think my problem was that when I think of "Igavania", SotN comes to mind. So when I heard "Igavania is back" I set myself up for disappointment. Instead, I should probably have thought of the DS entries. I didn't enjoy those all that much and for some of the same reasons as RotN.

 

[Amzin]

I think my problem was that when I think of "Igavania", SotN comes to mind. So when I heard "Igavania is back" I set myself up for disappointment. Instead, I should probably have thought of the DS entries. I didn't enjoy those all that much and for some of the same reasons as RotN.

Yea, it's hard to compete with what is regarded as one of the all-time best. SotN isn't even my favorite of the genre but it IS great. Bloodstained is alright but it has a lot of room for improvement. I'm not sure if I want to try and power through to the end, and maybe replay if they do some QoL passes, or hold off entirely until then. It just wasn't fun anymore last night, after a pretty good early game.

 

[beep boop]

Yea, it's hard to compete with what is regarded as one of the all-time best. SotN isn't even my favorite of the genre but it IS great. Bloodstained is alright but it has a lot of room for improvement. I'm not sure if I want to try and power through to the end, and maybe replay if they do some QoL passes, or hold off entirely until then. It just wasn't fun anymore last night, after a pretty good early game.

I ended up re-installing and powering through to the end. That last area and the final bosses felt like they could've used more time in the oven. That entire area is really drab. Just hallways in a new theme (a pretty one though). No new tricks. Very anticlimactic.

 

[Kuro]

77% Map completion so far, and I don't want this game to ever end.. So damn good.
At least there's more content to come if I remember right, rogue-like dungeon?

 

[Parsnip]

With the recent hubbub about the switch version, it has made me wonder one thing.
How does it run on gpd win 2 and such?
I can only think of one person with the game and device, and that's Durante. Have you tried it?

 

[Amzin]

I'm at about 95% now, just the final stretch to go. I ended up using cheat engine to give myself infinite money to bypass grinding for drops, because I realized that's where a lot of my hangup was - either I was unlucky in my initial drops or the requirements are just a bit much but I was way behind in gear and I had no reason to revisit areas at all except to grind, and most of the drops require many (4-10+) of like 4-8% drop rates. Even with my luck as high as I could get it, over 70, it was incredibly boring and tedious. Makes me think if the drop rates for components was much higher (like, 4x at a base) it would flow a lot better.


In SotN you just farmed for completed items and it was relatively quick, in BS you are farming for components and usually need multiple drops from multiple enemies often in different zones and much of the high-end gear requires other gear to build which requires either a bunch of gold or more drops from multiple enemies in previous zones, etc.

Every discussion on items I see talks about how broken this or that rank 9 shard or very end-tier weapon is, which may be, but the mid game sure does suck if you aren't lucky or don't grind. Flattening out a lot of the RNG would go a long way to improving it.

Edit: Also, there are multiple guides and topics about how to either AFK farm gold or rapidly farm gold, which kind of supports my theory that the grind is an issue for a lot of people.

 

[beep boop]

What's funny is that the entire last area mostly only has money (500g) in those chests instead of end game items. Like, come on I'm practically done with the game, give me the good stuff!

I would've preferred the crafting system to go and have the items be distributed in chests. Some as rare drops. That makes a lot more sense than grinding in the context of the game's stated design philosophy.

 

[QFNS]

I'm at about 95% now, just the final stretch to go. I ended up using cheat engine to give myself infinite money to bypass grinding for drops, because I realized that's where a lot of my hangup was - either I was unlucky in my initial drops or the requirements are just a bit much but I was way behind in gear and I had no reason to revisit areas at all except to grind, and most of the drops require many (4-10+) of like 4-8% drop rates. Even with my luck as high as I could get it, over 70, it was incredibly boring and tedious. Makes me think if the drop rates for components was much higher (like, 4x at a base) it would flow a lot better.


In SotN you just farmed for completed items and it was relatively quick, in BS you are farming for components and usually need multiple drops from multiple enemies often in different zones and much of the high-end gear requires other gear to build which requires either a bunch of gold or more drops from multiple enemies in previous zones, etc.

Every discussion on items I see talks about how broken this or that rank 9 shard or very end-tier weapon is, which may be, but the mid game sure does suck if you aren't lucky or don't grind. Flattening out a lot of the RNG would go a long way to improving it.

Edit: Also, there are multiple guides and topics about how to either AFK farm gold or rapidly farm gold, which kind of supports my theory that the grind is an issue for a lot of people.

It's not an issue for me so much as I think it IS the endgame of the game. Farming for mats and levels and whatnot to become OP is basically the endgame (assuming you want to become OP). So your options for improvement are either do all that stuff or get good at the bosses & their patterns to survive with lower health and less OP items. Its either or IMO. I'm kind of enjoying the mindless grind for money to complete the collection lists and monster table and whathaveyou. I totally understand that it's not for everyone and definitely if you get bored, turn on that CE and get you some free stuff so you can get back to the good part which is running around seeing all the weird stuff in this game.

 

[Wibblewozzer]

What's funny is that the entire last area mostly only has money (500g) in those chests instead of end game items. Like, come on I'm practically done with the game, give me the good stuff!

I would've preferred the crafting system to go and have the items be distributed in chests. Some as rare drops. That makes a lot more sense than grinding in the context of the game's stated design philosophy.

That was annoying and finding that certain items for crafting only drop in blue chests by region. So to farm those you have to leave the area and return repeatedly to get the blue chests to respawn.

 

[Phoenix RISING]

Grinding is a NO from me. Especially for action games.

 

[Amzin]

It's not an issue for me so much as I think it IS the endgame of the game. Farming for mats and levels and whatnot to become OP is basically the endgame (assuming you want to become OP). So your options for improvement are either do all that stuff or get good at the bosses & their patterns to survive with lower health and less OP items. Its either or IMO. I'm kind of enjoying the mindless grind for money to complete the collection lists and monster table and whathaveyou. I totally understand that it's not for everyone and definitely if you get bored, turn on that CE and get you some free stuff so you can get back to the good part which is running around seeing all the weird stuff in this game.

Grinding is a NO from me. Especially for action games.

I finished the story today, but nothing really changed my feelings, they pretty much reinforced.

I think a lot of the problem is the RNG and the scaling. When I started digging into recipes and drops I hadn't seen I realized how bad my luck had been, despite trying to keep my luck stat maxed out. Even with luck as high as I could get it to get at least 1-2 of a resource from certain enemies, it took hours for not that much progress, and that's with me nulling most of the grind with the fact you can buy and then dismantle anything you've crafted. But most higher tier items all require different stuff, and a lot of them are kinda meh but you don't know until you craft it, and the dismantle material is crazy expensive for how much you need to use to utilize the crafting system... the whole thing just flows and is balanced pretty badly. Some people might breeze through and it'll feel great, for me I had to dedicate time and cheating to make actual progress and that again took hours longer than I felt was reasonable, and I'm no where near 100% on items list still.

The comparison of complete items vs. single components for SotN vs. BS is really striking to me. The drop rates on some components in BS are higher than whole items in SotN, but not by much, and you need so much to craft something. The grind is just unreal for this kind of game, and while a lot of it might be pointless, that doesn't make it feel less like bad design. In SotN, or Hollow Knight, or any of the other genre games I can think of, I don't remember ever having to just stop doing what I wanted to do and go cross reference drop lists and recipes and farm for 2-5 hours to catch up to where I was apparently supposed to be.

It's extra frustrating because the base game (with input lag fixed) is good, I just dislike a lot of the decisions involved in the RPG side of it (and I like RPGs, hell I like MMOs). The variety of weapons is neat but you get stuck using whatever the best one you've had drop or had the drops to craft is, and because there's so many "tiers" you may go for hours without using any types you prefer to use. I actually have still not seen the top 4 or 5 boots, and I could never find a "competitive" boot during the game after getting off the boat, despite it being one of my favorite weapon types I essentially didn't use it.

I would rate the game way higher if they flattened out the tiers of weapons a lot, remove a ton of the grinding and RNG too. I think I said the drops should be like 4x as much as they are and I actually think it should be higher than that unless the number of components gets cut down. There are so many shards, too, and most maybe don't suck but if you are struggling to progress you are only ever going to use the broken one or two you've got.

It feels like it took the worst ideas of RPGs and adapted them. Want the game to be balanced? Just spend half again as much game time grinding, but don't overshoot or it'll be too easy. Want it to be hard? Just try and fly through it without backtracking and hope your drops aren't too generous. And the middle ground isn't "balanced" because of the huge variation in stats and power, and limited healing resources, making new areas super deadly.

Note: When I'm talking about hours grinding, even using cheat engine, I'm not kidding. I have 24 hours played and at least 5 of those from the past couple days are basically just trying to round out my equipment, get through those side quests. Backtracking through areas I'd 100% explored and even sometimes farmed previously, just to try and get more drops to catch up for the last area.

I tend to dislike grinds in my singleplayer games at all, but it's especially obnoxious in a genre that has no call for it. I'm really disappointed this game isn't what it could be, and that there's no way it will ever be because that would require too much of an overhaul. I'm not sure I would rate it negative on Steam, but it's close. This is like a 6/10 for me through and through, despite so much potential and pedigree.

 

[Line]

The grinding comes from the Sorrow games, pretty much in its entirety.
And believe me, it was way, way worse when you had shards that were included in the crafting (which would then be unavailable - and some were 0.5% and required multiple copies for one weapon... some were unique boss souls that you would lose forever!).

The grind is plain brutal if you want all the weapons. But otherwise? You really don't need it. There's plenty to be found along the way, though it is busywork to keep tabs on your optional shopping list. In that aspect, I found cooking to be much more annoying - multiple steps for each sub component is not exactly easy to remember.

And talking about cooking, like in all the Castlevania with "potions", it makes the game a cakewalk. You can have a near infinite source of HP, so I don't see how you'd need to grind for better weapons. You could just upgrade the 8 bit weapons for some gold, or even use none at all and just spam spells while chugging ethers. Not pretty, but very doable.
I defeated pretty much everything including the secret boss with a regular sword, the ultimate triple attacking sword would have been way overkill... even if it fun.

 

[OSatan]

DAT Chekhov

Spoiler

little girl

lol

Also did they gave the tip for the endgame AFTER starting the endgame?

 

[Phoenix RISING]

I finished the story today, but nothing really changed my feelings, they pretty much reinforced.

I think a lot of the problem is the RNG and the scaling. When I started digging into recipes and drops I hadn't seen I realized how bad my luck had been, despite trying to keep my luck stat maxed out. Even with luck as high as I could get it to get at least 1-2 of a resource from certain enemies, it took hours for not that much progress, and that's with me nulling most of the grind with the fact you can buy and then dismantle anything you've crafted. But most higher tier items all require different stuff, and a lot of them are kinda meh but you don't know until you craft it, and the dismantle material is crazy expensive for how much you need to use to utilize the crafting system... the whole thing just flows and is balanced pretty badly. Some people might breeze through and it'll feel great, for me I had to dedicate time and cheating to make actual progress and that again took hours longer than I felt was reasonable, and I'm no where near 100% on items list still.

The comparison of complete items vs. single components for SotN vs. BS is really striking to me. The drop rates on some components in BS are higher than whole items in SotN, but not by much, and you need so much to craft something. The grind is just unreal for this kind of game, and while a lot of it might be pointless, that doesn't make it feel less like bad design. In SotN, or Hollow Knight, or any of the other genre games I can think of, I don't remember ever having to just stop doing what I wanted to do and go cross reference drop lists and recipes and farm for 2-5 hours to catch up to where I was apparently supposed to be.

It's extra frustrating because the base game (with input lag fixed) is good, I just dislike a lot of the decisions involved in the RPG side of it (and I like RPGs, hell I like MMOs). The variety of weapons is neat but you get stuck using whatever the best one you've had drop or had the drops to craft is, and because there's so many "tiers" you may go for hours without using any types you prefer to use. I actually have still not seen the top 4 or 5 boots, and I could never find a "competitive" boot during the game after getting off the boat, despite it being one of my favorite weapon types I essentially didn't use it.

I would rate the game way higher if they flattened out the tiers of weapons a lot, remove a ton of the grinding and RNG too. I think I said the drops should be like 4x as much as they are and I actually think it should be higher than that unless the number of components gets cut down. There are so many shards, too, and most maybe don't suck but if you are struggling to progress you are only ever going to use the broken one or two you've got.

It feels like it took the worst ideas of RPGs and adapted them. Want the game to be balanced? Just spend half again as much game time grinding, but don't overshoot or it'll be too easy. Want it to be hard? Just try and fly through it without backtracking and hope your drops aren't too generous. And the middle ground isn't "balanced" because of the huge variation in stats and power, and limited healing resources, making new areas super deadly.

Note: When I'm talking about hours grinding, even using cheat engine, I'm not kidding. I have 24 hours played and at least 5 of those from the past couple days are basically just trying to round out my equipment, get through those side quests. Backtracking through areas I'd 100% explored and even sometimes farmed previously, just to try and get more drops to catch up for the last area.

I tend to dislike grinds in my singleplayer games at all, but it's especially obnoxious in a genre that has no call for it. I'm really disappointed this game isn't what it could be, and that there's no way it will ever be because that would require too much of an overhaul. I'm not sure I would rate it negative on Steam, but it's close. This is like a 6/10 for me through and through, despite so much potential and pedigree.

Agreed 100%.


I posted this in the Steam thread; I really did give this game a 6.5, but I'd say you are even harsher of a critic, because I actually enjoyed the game; the bugs killed it for me.

I also mention in my review,

I would have stuck with martial arts attacks if the RNG allowed me to roll the necessary items to craft what was appropriate for my level and the enemies that I faced. I had to settle for a polearm—specifically a shovel—more than I wanted to because for a long time, it was my most potent weapon;

Yeah, I also wanted to kick things, but the stupid RNG didn't give me the drops for the craft.

And then, those NPCs who want high-level stuff for quests. Good luck getting that stuff to spawn.

The old woman wanted me to make her crepes, but for some reason, the recipe calls for a dragon's egg!!! WTF?!?!?!?!?

That's ridiculous.

 

[prudis]

Bloodstained's includes 13 FREE DLCs after launch.
THIRTEEN. FREE. DLCs.

• New Game Plus
• 8bit Level
• Nightmare Difficulty
• Pure Miriam Set
• Boss Rush Mode
• Speed Run Mode

Post-Launch Free DLC:

• Co-op & Vs.
• Local and online multiplayer
• Roguelike dungeon
• 2 extra playable characters
• Chaos Mode
• Classic Mode
• Boss Revenge Mode

 

[prudis]

Game Mode Changes

One of the promised stretch goals for the game was Roguelike. Unfortunately, the code that was created early in the game’s development is not currently compatible with this type of gameplay (especially a procedurally generated castle). Due to this, we regret to announce that we will not be developing Roguelike as part of the project's planned stretch goals.

We know this is a mode that many of you were eagerly anticipating and we apologize that we will not be able to make it happen as planned.

We don’t want to leave a hole in the roster, so we have developed a new game mode called “Randomizer” to take its place. Randomizer will launch with Zangetsu and be available for free. Details on Randomizer are laid out below.


Boss Revenge Mode

On Discord, “Boss Revenge” mode had previously been mentioned as launching at the same time as Zangetsu. This statement was made in error. Boss Revenge is scheduled for the content update that follows Zangetsu and Randomizer.


Switch News

Switch players may have already noticed the 1.04 update that went live in January. While this was the last Switch update focused primarily on performance, we are not done working to improve the platform. Switch has come a long way since launch and we are happy with the progress it has made, but there is still more to do (especially in large rooms/dragon towers). We will continually roll out enhancements along with content updates to make the experience as smooth as possible.


Content Cadence

Switch 1.04 brought all the platforms (PC, PS4, Xbox and Switch) into ‘Content Parity’, which is a fancy way to say that they all have the same stuff. This was a big milestone for the game. When all the platforms are at the same place, it makes future updates easier to manage. The production teams can all work on the same content and release updates on a schedule with shorter gaps between them.


Randomizer Mode Details

Randomizer is the story campaign you’re used to, but with a twist. Before starting a game, players can choose up to eight different game parameters to be randomized during the playthrough.

As an example, “Items - Retain Method” means that items will be found in the same spawn method (chest, mob drop, etc.) as normal. Items found in chests will still be found in chests, they will just get mixed around. “Total random” means anything can drop anywhere.


The mode will ensure safeguards to ensure that items needed to complete the game will be obtainable, so you can’t softlock your progress.

Once you make your selections, you can generate a seed that you can use for reference or to share with someone else. In addition, a timer will track your progress through the game and display your completion time at the end of a run.


We hope that everyone will enjoy the new mode and work to get the shortest clear time possible for your permutations!

 

[QFNS]

I think I'm ok with a randomizer instead of a roguelike mode. I've played the Dark Souls 1 randomizer and it's been hilariously fun.

 

[Rando10123]

I think I'm ok with a randomizer instead of a roguelike mode. I've played the Dark Souls 1 randomizer and it's been hilariously fun.

I wish Randomizer also had random enemy placements, that would've been fun, but maybe not worth it because certain progress shards might never appear.