Sorry, but where was it stated? I have seen it mentioned several times in the thread, but cannot find the source.
News Epic Games Store
- Thread starter Blizniak
- Start date
Hades, the first EGS exclusive, is coming to Steam on December 10th
I'm happy more people are going to get to play it. I love Supergiant games so I couldn't wait, it is fantastic.
www.resetera.com
Awesome. Can’t wait for Elden Ring.
Bandai Namco’s Hoerdt on how Epic Games Store and subscription models are potential ‘threats’ - MCV/DEVELOP
Bandai Namco’s Hervé Hoerdt, SVP of marketing, digital and content for Europe, tells MCV@gamescom about the rise of new ways to engage with content and the threats it could represent, while embracing what streaming can bring to the tablewww.mcvuk.com
Banco not a fan of exclusivity.
A dev like Supergiant Games is too big, even for an indie dev, to completely flop all the way around.
I still don't know who that is.
Mr. SteamSpy ... who turned out to be a literal spy for Papa Tim (shocking, i know)
Food for thought:
The exclusive period may be over in December but the Steampage is open already and you can wishlist the game.
Any potential Hades EGS customer that prefers Steam and has no problems waiting, will probably buy it on Steam.
There could be a situation, that the guaranteed sales number is still not fulfilled. So it is insanely better for Supergiant if the customers bought the game on Steam.
If there are still, like 5000 to 10000 guarantees open, Supergiant gets nothing from it (because Epic already paid for those units) If those customers buy on Steam instead (or wait for it to release on Steam), they get a whole bunch of money.
Is Epic Ok with that?
The exclusive period may be over in December but the Steampage is open already and you can wishlist the game.
Any potential Hades EGS customer that prefers Steam and has no problems waiting, will probably buy it on Steam.
There could be a situation, that the guaranteed sales number is still not fulfilled. So it is insanely better for Supergiant if the customers bought the game on Steam.
If there are still, like 5000 to 10000 guarantees open, Supergiant gets nothing from it (because Epic already paid for those units) If those customers buy on Steam instead (or wait for it to release on Steam), they get a whole bunch of money.
Is Epic Ok with that?
well ... i mean ... i don't think those sales are time-limited ... so even if there's 10k "copies" left they won't start getting any money until epic sell those remaining 10k copies (i think)
I mean, yeah I think Epic is okay with this. Not every exclusive is going to meet expectations - so that Epic might be holding the bag for a while is a risk theyre obviously willing to take.
It just means EGS sales will go to Epic until such a threshold is met, as I understand the agreements
To be fair, recent news regarding Pathologic 2 is good counter-example on how guaranteed front-loaded money might be preferred over potential longevity; there are some games that actually need the money to survive. Too bad Epic isn't interested in poaching anything but almost finished games though.
Edit: Just read further clarification from the devs. Hope Pathologic 2 succeeds, as it will be good example that persisting on multi-platform should be beneficial for indies over money bag even in desperate situations (besides the fact that Pathologic was pretty cool).
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Hey, remember when Take Two CEO was not a fan of exclusivity as well?Bandai Namco’s Hoerdt on how Epic Games Store and subscription models are potential ‘threats’ - MCV/DEVELOP
Bandai Namco’s Hervé Hoerdt, SVP of marketing, digital and content for Europe, tells MCV@gamescom about the rise of new ways to engage with content and the threats it could represent, while embracing what streaming can bring to the table
Banco not a fan of exclusivity.
Just before Private Division going all in on EGS exclusivity?
apparently the situation isn't QUITE as bad:
Pathologic 2 dev's response to the latest rumours:
... or how Rebellion said they won't do it ... and then immediately did it with Nazi Zombies 4?
Tim seems to view comments like those as a challenge more than anything ... unfortunately
Well, Supergiant has no incentive to advertise their game on EGS, unless the sales pick up and they go beyond the guarantee, (where they get money from a copy again.)
And Epic has no incentive to advertise Hades, or give away copies, because they would have to pay Supergiant for every copy after the guarantee.
What a scenario, lol. No-one would be interested in the game selling.
I think I asked this before, but I'll do it again because I'm bored:
It's 2018 (before EGS), and you're Supergiant. You're about to release an action roguelike on Steam Early Access that resembles your best seller in Bastion.
How many copies do you think this game could do on Steam in a year? Give me the low and give me the high.
---
Now you're Supergiant and you're approached by Epic to make a deal. It's an early access title, so in your mind, people are still getting a better product on Steam, and you're able to keep the studio afloat until your next title. How much do you think Epic offers, and how much does Supergiant demand? They're coming off Pyre, which didn't light the charts on fire. I could see Steamspy using it against them. This is also before all the backlash towards Epic.
It's 2018 (before EGS), and you're Supergiant. You're about to release an action roguelike on Steam Early Access that resembles your best seller in Bastion.
How many copies do you think this game could do on Steam in a year? Give me the low and give me the high.
---
Now you're Supergiant and you're approached by Epic to make a deal. It's an early access title, so in your mind, people are still getting a better product on Steam, and you're able to keep the studio afloat until your next title. How much do you think Epic offers, and how much does Supergiant demand? They're coming off Pyre, which didn't light the charts on fire. I could see Steamspy using it against them. This is also before all the backlash towards Epic.
oh, they ABSOLUTELY did ... at least now we know why he really needed all that data
the actual hell
is today the day of posting images that you will hate forever or something?
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What? Its just the uncompressed version of his twitter pfp.
Reminds me to that thread about Steam payment chart in which prepaid card is the majority. People was like that's a bullshit who don't use credit card for payment these days. It's like those people don't know that the world is not just USA or Europe
Anno 1800 is free to play until Sunday while they release the DLC. Did it bomb that badly on the EGS? I dont remember a free weekend period for any previous Anno game on Steam.
It's also free on uplay.
It probably bombed everywhere.
Which is a shame because it's a good anno iteration.
? They don't have problems ?
Pathologic 2 dev's response to the latest rumours:
I don't think it bombed. Ubisoft does lots of free weekends when new dlc comes out.
This said, I haven't bought anything for Ubisoft since they went in bed with Epic.
Yeah I made that post in response to the rumors before I saw the dev had responded. Didn't feel like coming back to edit what I said.
I'll own being wrong.
You were wrong anyway, what dimension do you live in where all "good" games sell? If Shenmue was good it'd have sold enough to not have 3 come out a decade++ later after crowd funding, sony funding & epic deals, if Panzer Dragoon Saga was good it'd have been serialized and/or save the Saturn, if Beyond Good & Evil was good we'd already have more of it, etc. Vs dodgy games selling well like the flavor of the week with "mixed" or "negative" reception on Steam top sales charts. Not to mention all the great studios that were having enough problems to shut down like Looking Glass Studios despite their insane pedigree.
Anyway, good to know the studio's not doing as badly as reported, though it's not exactly a bright picture they paint there despite doing so to dispel doom talk.
Anyway, good to know the studio's not doing as badly as reported, though it's not exactly a bright picture they paint there despite doing so to dispel doom talk.
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This what i do too.
I have a good number of Ubi games and i mostly buy from Uplay but since they start the asshole association i stopped.
There were early signs though.
At first they took some of my uplay points away because they made them expiring.
Then there was this time saver thing in AC Odyssey which was really annoying, I admit that i would have minded less if there was an XP bonus for gold edition owners like it was in Origins but the principle of it is stupid and forced some minor imbalance to the game, because ,,, hey they have to sell this stuff.
Then they nerfed the xp earned from user made quests for Odyssey, but i had dropped the game after the stupid narrative issue with the protagonist's child and stuff.
Now, although i am extremely interested for the new Anno i will get it only if a good offer comes up from a keyseller. Ubi is not going to see my money soon.
And i also do not find their subscription plan tempting, even their free month leaves me completely uninterested.
In don't know. I'm not here because I hate epic or the people using the store. I just hate third party exclusivity and I'm not willing to support it. I also hate being lied to, like by Tim or put in a drawer with racists and idiots just because I'm not buying third party exclusive titles.
Anno, Assassins Creed number 1257 and Ghost Recon Something are first party games.
In all honesty, I'm more surprised that those games were available on Steam for such a long period of time.
But I never had a problem with ME 3 or Destiny 2 being sold on Origin and B.net, so I don't feel especially bad about those Ubisoft first party titles being sold on Uplay and in addition on EGS. I understand that people don't want to have their collections split and yes I'd prefer a scenario where ubisoft games are available everywhere. I use multiple launchers and I'm happy about GOG 2.0 coming to life. But I would have used EGS, if EGS had a different business strategy. At least on some games and for some developers to make sure they get the extra cut.
Ubi took the courage to make the jump and divorce Steam, because Epic presented a nice money pillow. I also get that, but as said. The games aren't exclusive to Epic.
I'm more curious about the special kind of idiot who bought an ubi game from EGS instead of directly from uplay. I see no reason to do so.
If you want to support the developer: use their store.
And yes: Ubis subscription plan is boring, at best.
I agree with most of this. But there are other reasons as well.
You see, I've always considered Ubisoft still offering their games on Steam - despite having their own client- a very pro-consumer move. But lately I don't see Ubisoft as very pro-consumer anymore.
This isn't only because they dropped Steam and went in bed with Epic. There's also the uPlay points becoming limited in time (I lost 90% of my points because of this), pulling their games from 3rd party keystores, introducing a battle pass for R6 Siege, forcing people to pre-order Anno if they wanted the Steam version, no longer investing in niche/innovative games like Child of Light etc etc etc.
Of course, all of this doesn't make Ubisoft as bad as EA or Activision. But I don't see them as a pro-consumer publisher anymore. While I won't go as far as boycotting them, this does have a negative impact on my purchase behavior.
Good points and I'd even understand if you'd boycott Ubi because of it. If you don't like Ubisoft for various reasons. That's okay with me.* Personally I started to dislike them a bit more when they introduced time savers in black flag.
But maybe the difference is that I never perceived Ubi to be pro consumer in the first place? So I'm not surprised...
I don't even think Nintendo is pro consumer. I just think they like the image.
But yeah, that's just my look on the cooperate world.
Edit
*(Not that you need my permission. I wanted to say that I'd understand you.)
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Ubi's still aiding Epic with their moves, wouldn't have a problem if they went 100% UPlay exclusive (which they essentially have while still taking Epic's money so it was pretty smart of them but still I won't touch anything that helps Epic in this manner - though I guess I can't exclude Unreal Engine games that is less direct). At least their client has learned from all Steam does and offers a ton of shit EGS does not and never will. It's better than Origin too.
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The same dimension you live in.
You just named a series of niche games as a metric. Also consider that it's not so important that a game get a sequel, such much as the dev is able to keep making games. Supergiant is an example of a company that keeps things fresh, which is why I liked them. Klei is another.
Looking Glas became Irrational Games became Ghost Story Games. They're still around.
I was boycotting Ubisofts stuff before it was cool . Even when their shit was on steam (which was a token thing at best) i still avoided ubisoft shit like it was a syphilis infested dong. I loathe and despise their client/store/spawn of satan to me it is one step away from the god awfulness that is Epic's shit show. To be fair though Ubisoft does make it rather easy to boycott their stuff these days what with all the microtransaction crap and the fact their games just are not interesting.
. Even when their shit was on steam (which was a token thing at best) i still avoided ubisoft shit like it was a syphilis infested dong. I loathe and despise their client/store/spawn of satan to me it is one step away from the god awfulness that is Epic's shit show. To be fair though Ubisoft does make it rather easy to boycott their stuff these days what with all the microtransaction crap and the fact their games just are not interesting.
Yes I mentioned some niche games. Like Pathologic itself and every game from that studio. So? Can niche not be good? Can niche not sell less than its niche hoped and therefor have problems? You certainly didn't make the distinction there, just spoke about how "good" games apparently can't have problems. None of those sold enough to cover costs or expectations. That's a problem. SEGA didn't shut down because of them (but still had a ton of its own problems) doesn't mean much when they still didn't wanna invest more in them or things like them at the time. Team Andromeda was dissolved anyway, they didn't just get renamed like other SEGA studios over time, the staff was scattered to the winds, some still at SEGA, others not. None of that goes against my points, I could have mentioned it in that post and make the same points. No, Looking Glass isn't around. And even if they were that doesn't show they didn't have problems. If they didn't have problems they'd have just been renamed rather than shut down and later resurface in some form with some of the staff or whatever else.
And you not preferring sequels (yet there's so many sequels that sell well, hmmm, how weird, not) doesn't change the fact some of those games were meant to have them but didn't because despite any critical and user acclaim they didn't sell enough for that to happen.
Anyway, popular doesn't equal good, unpopular (enough to not sell well enough) doesn't equal bad, that's all I was saying since your statement was both absolute and without any further explanations and qualifications at the time, feel free to disagree (and be wrong, for every field, from actual games to games platforms to music to whatever else, plenty shit sells a ton and plenty good shit doesn't, that's just fact).
And you not preferring sequels (yet there's so many sequels that sell well, hmmm, how weird, not) doesn't change the fact some of those games were meant to have them but didn't because despite any critical and user acclaim they didn't sell enough for that to happen.
Anyway, popular doesn't equal good, unpopular (enough to not sell well enough) doesn't equal bad, that's all I was saying since your statement was both absolute and without any further explanations and qualifications at the time, feel free to disagree (and be wrong, for every field, from actual games to games platforms to music to whatever else, plenty shit sells a ton and plenty good shit doesn't, that's just fact).
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PC-Patriot Lol, I'm starting to develop a similar stance against EA. It's not quite there yet. But damn they are making it easy to hate them.
EA: there is a new NFS game.
ME: I've not even clicked on the trailer and I'm already tired of your shit.
EA: there is a new NFS game.
ME: I've not even clicked on the trailer and I'm already tired of your shit.
To be fair you listed two games that saw an exclusive release on a platform that was already circling the drain. I think it says more that "exclusivity kills sales" rather than "good games don't sell". I remember reading about Shenmue in the days of sega saturn and wanted it so much but no bloody way was I gonna buy a damn 300 quid console for it. Then when Shenmue was finally released on the PC to be honest it had been that long I didn't really care anymore. If you limit your audience don't be suprised when your game/franchise dies seems to be the moral here.
No problem mate, wasn't sure you saw this statement
I mean, it was SEGA games for SEGA platforms, might as well claim exclusivity breeds success by default by pointing to Nintendo or Sony who keep trucking instead of SEGA who (eventually, not initially!) failed and went third party. That wasn't the point. Looking Glass games were largely exclusive to PC, I guess they don't count either? Meh. Either way there were no such qualifications in the post I replied to, outside the game circumstances can exist too for sure so to say studio x wouldn't have problems if game y was good is still silly as it ignores all such circumstances you point the finger to even as you disagree with me.
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They are certainly looking very close into the lessons from EA and Activision now, including getting a lot more aggressive with the GaaS model. Assassin's Creed Odyssey for example: at launch the game progression wasn't really impacted by the micro transactions. But then they raised the level cap from 50 to 99 and suddenly there was a lot of grinding to meet the requirements to upgrade your "favorite" gear to keep it up with your level. Thankfully on PC we still have the Cheat Engine.
While I really like Assassin's Creed games, I was already getting annoyed by all their recent moves, including using Epic to deflect any fallout from the decision to leave Steam, but then they also went and adjusted the regional prices over here. The "Gold" edition of the next Watch Dog game is now 75% more expensive than the gold edition of AC:Odyssey, and the base edition is now on the same price level as EA or Bethesda games.
So even though 'm not at the point of boycotting them, it is really easy to move from "Day 1" to "wait until at least 50% off" category.
Of course, seeing people talking about Looking Glass on this thread really reminds me why they aren't as bad as EA.... but they sure appear to be on their way to be one day.
Although the medium is different, there are ton of cases where films unappreciated at the release are appreciated years later.
Or film can be good and well-received, but still not sell well enough to be in green. This one can apply game development as well because good game-making ability and good financial management are not exactly same thing.
Or film can be good and well-received, but still not sell well enough to be in green. This one can apply game development as well because good game-making ability and good financial management are not exactly same thing.
The distinction is that if a game is good, it will sell. I said what I said.
If a game is niche, then it begins with fighting an uphill battle. Therefore, not only does it have to be good, it also has to be better than the host of games that aren't niche to gain the traction that justifies its existence. Hence, every other game being a roguelite, a metroidvania, or a deck builder.
Andromeda was Bioware's C-team. We know the core team was working on Anthem.
Nostalgic Looking Glasses.
The only place where I remember seeing people talk about games like The Bouncer or God Hand was Era.
The only place where I remember seeing people talk about games like The Bouncer or God Hand was Era.
I know what you said, I paraphrased and quoted it and argued against it. Duh?
You need to learn more about gaming if you think I mentioned Mass Effect Andromeda or anything to do with Bioware there, I had to do a double take.
Maybe after doing that you'd learn it's dumb to correlate sales or relative success with quality to such an absolute degree about anything, and games.
You need to learn more about gaming if you think I mentioned Mass Effect Andromeda or anything to do with Bioware there, I had to do a double take.
Maybe after doing that you'd learn it's dumb to correlate sales or relative success with quality to such an absolute degree about anything, and games.
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No way in hell im boycotting Ubisoft games. Call them "same formula" games as much as you want, but I really enjoy them, especially AC games. Six Siege is also one of the best tactical shooters of all time imo.
Will definetly at least try out Uplay+.
Will definetly at least try out Uplay+.
Honestly, I don't think there's much room for the Uplay and Origin subscriptions now Game Pass for PC is a thing. Microsoft just has more clout at getting bigger names on the service and can leverage their Xbox base to do it, and I don't think PC players are in a rush to subscribe to multiple services.
If you really must play every Ubisoft or EA game, then I guess those are worth it, but in terms of breadth and variety of content both services will be severely lacking compared to Game Pass.
If you really must play every Ubisoft or EA game, then I guess those are worth it, but in terms of breadth and variety of content both services will be severely lacking compared to Game Pass.
well they certainly made it really easy for me to stop buying their games .... i literally don't own ANY ubi games directly on udontplay ... i've always been buying them on steam ... so when they stopped selling them on steam, i stopped buying them (the fact that they started loading them chock-full of gaas bullshit only helped, naturally)