If the right to resell digital goods becomes law it will affect every digital distributor on every platform, it won't be just for Valve.
Community MetaSteam | September 2019 - Valve, I Know What You Did Last Summer!
- Thread starter lashman
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If the right to resell digital goods becomes law it will affect every digital distributor on every platform, it won't be just for Valve.
He is implying that publishers will change their monetization model to even more micro transactions, region locks, ect. because they will be losing money on initial sales. I think it is a reasonable long term fear.
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No it wouldn’t, don’t be ridiculous.
There are all kinds of negative possible outcomes from this.
- More draconian DRM solutions as a kneejerk reaction from pubs.
- Higher prices, either in localities that pass this kind of law or worldwide.
- Games no longer being launched and sold in certain regions.
- Even more aggressive monetization solutions.
- And perhaps worst of all, an even faster switch to subscription model game consumption.
It might result in Sony, Valve and Epic (and others) to start a catalog of subscription games to match GamePass/UPlay+, etc, which would seem nice. But on the other hand, it might cause games to become subscription dependent and exclusive, a la Stadia or (from a different industry, Netflix or Amazon Prime). One of the main contentions of this French case seems to be Valve’s definition of a “subscription,” to which they might just say “Fuck it” then and start having traditional subscriptions.
It’s not an objective good, because I can think of a dozen ways this could go tits up.
If something goes into law, isn't that then considered to actually be something for the greater good? Meaning, that's why the law came into being in the first place, to correct something that was considered bad. So a law is never something "neither good or bad", more about how much one cares about it or agree/disagree with it.
Fair enough, I disagree but I accept it as an opinion.
I can see your point, I don't agree that such a scenario is likely but it is plausible.
This already happens. Nothing to do with the ability to resell goods. Why not blame piracy instead?
GaaS is trendy because it is lucrative.
MTX/DLC are everywhere. You have MTX in CTR, and several DLC for Shenmue 3 (including one focused on gambling).
People play Gears 5 for $1 on day one, and the game is sold for $70 on Steam. One gets to choose between a cheap sub or an overpriced game.
The world is not ready for reselling goods? Then how is it ready for subscriptions? Or automatic refunds on Steam? Or piracy?
Law always lag behind. I am not worried: publishers will quickly find possible ways around the law. At least, we will be able to resell/buy our games.
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The “easier” solution in this case might end up being that developers just don’t sell their game in France (or whatever other countries initially follow suit). Or if they do, they give them a later launch date or something similar.
The implication is obviously that those things would transition from being primarily used by AA and AAA titles to influencing the game design of every game, even smaller indie titles.
Interesting how some people reject a legislation that would benefits them because it could potentially hurt their hobby.
I'm serious, it's not an attack, ironic or whatever.
But if we fight things that could benefit us on the basis that pubs could react badly, doesn't that make us hostage ? thonking-emoji
I'm serious, it's not an attack, ironic or whatever.
But if we fight things that could benefit us on the basis that pubs could react badly, doesn't that make us hostage ? thonking-emoji
It is a mixed bag about reselling digital goods. Base price may increase as you know how pubs are. 2H shit price will probably not be worth it in the end also. Poor indie devs lol.
It's a high risk - high reward situation, we may win big or we can lose big and it's hard to predict in which direction pendulum will swing.
Honestly, Apple Arcade has a lot of interesting games I wanna play, some games that are EGS exclusive for now (What the Golf, Sayonara probably, Pathless), but I don't have any iOS devices.
Yup. Reselling games is great and if that's everything that we could get out of the law, I would be all for it. But I highly fear the consequences over it. Pubs/devs can be really shitty at times.
Yup. Reselling games is great and if that's everything that we could get out of the law, I would be all for it. But I highly fear the consequences over it. Pubs/devs can be really shitty at times.
This would be by far my greatest concern.
And I think it's quite likely, in a scenario where reselling laws are adopted and enforced globally.
This might apply to some, but presenting it as a general statement presupposes that it would actually be a benefit to everyone.
Personally, I've never sold a game in my life.
On the other hand, I've modded a lot of games and enjoyed having settings in even more games, and both of those are simply gone in a streaming-only scenario.
(Let's not even talk about the preservation aspect since that's too depressing)
I think the discussion here is interesting. I won't even look in some other place though. It must be a blood bath.
I mean, the sub future doesn't seem that far off unfortunately. Could it accelerate the process ? Maybe, even definitely. But I don't think this evolution would stop even if things stayed as they are.
Hmm, good point, but won't it be the case very soon, legislation or not ?
I mean, the sub future doesn't seem that far off unfortunately. Could it accelerate the process ? Maybe, even definitely. But I don't think this evolution would stop even if things stayed as they are.
It's similar to the 12% cut argument of publishers getting more money = more/better games that I like.
The difference being that an 18% larger cut is peanuts in comparison to the figures we'd be facing due to global digital reselling.
Apparently developers can now add support contacts to their steampage, cool:
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Apparently developers can now add support contacts to their steampage, cool:
that's an augmented steam thing
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Maniac
As the name suggests. The OG Maniac.
It would also likely end up being the final nail in the coffin for medium-sized devs and increase the volatility and risk of being indie by a hundredfold.
There's tons of negative ramifications this would have, for obvious reasons.
I honestly can't even tell what's part of what anymore tbh, enhanced/augmented steam have always been such a core part of the steam store experience
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Which means again, getting payed by Epic (or Apple for Apple Arcade) for exclusivity would be even more lucrative.
I’m actually mildly excited about trying Apple Arcade today because it looks like it has a lot of high quality games.
My worry though is obviously if high quality games become locked into a sub like that.
From what Ive read, games exclusive to Apple Arcade are mobile exclusive, so they won't hit Android, but Apple doesn't count consoles and PC as mobile devicdes, so they are free to be releases on PC and consoles. I still wonder though why What the Golf says 2020 on EGS while already being out on Apple Arcade.
Yep. Console and PC arent effected by these deals. Several games are launching on Steam or console today that are also launching “exclusively on apple arcade”
It could be that Apple is forcing them. For instance, Jenny LeClue is releasing today on Apple and Steam, but the release date was previously September 30th on Steam. Maybe it was a placeholder, or maybe they had to release earlier on Steam to match Apple (cf. Steam agreements)?
Neo Cab, soon! The demo sold me on it.
Wow @ Bloodstained also being on PC gamepass
#7 on my steam wishlist. Still kinda full price and selling very well too so that is surprising.
Also that is like 20 bucks saved during the winter sale.
#7 on my steam wishlist. Still kinda full price and selling very well too so that is surprising.
Also that is like 20 bucks saved during the winter sale.
I tried Jenny Clue demo. I really liked it. Will buy once Im done with some other games.
Dev from zeboyd games wrote this on ERA about reselling games on Steam:
www.resetera.com
Dev from zeboyd games wrote this on ERA about reselling games on Steam:
Steam should let users resell games, French court rules
But that's patently untrue. On consoles the console itself is DRM. You can't make copies of the disc that work on the console and you can't make digital copies that work either. The license is tied to a user and thus, can be untied and transferred. The current protections against piracy will be...
www.resetera.com
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Just trying to imagine how reselling used games on steam would work...
A) Valve/developer would be forced to buyback your games with the value dropping based on time after release.
or
B) Valve just treats your games like items in your inventory where you can sell game to other users in the marketplace with Valve/Devs taking a cut of each transaction.
Either of those 2 options would be amazing. B would probably make the most sense and not affect PC gaming too drastically imo.
A) Valve/developer would be forced to buyback your games with the value dropping based on time after release.
or
B) Valve just treats your games like items in your inventory where you can sell game to other users in the marketplace with Valve/Devs taking a cut of each transaction.
Either of those 2 options would be amazing. B would probably make the most sense and not affect PC gaming too drastically imo.
B wouldnt work because no one would ever buy a game new after week 1 when you get the identical game cheaper used so it would pretty much kill PC gaming as devs and publishers would make no money. A would only work if the buyback went down exponentially fast like gamestop where most AAA games net you $5 at most, but still it makes no sense because why would they do that aside from "legality". It would be easier and cheaper just to pay the fines.
There is no reason to assume that the sky would fall if reselling games was possible. Available copies would still be a finite resource and many more people would be willing to buy games day 1 if they knew that they could get some of their money back.
Apparently there are many reasons, as stated in this thread. Disagreeing with the reasons is fine, but stating there are no reasons is silly imo.
so basically it's better to not sell your games otherwise we'd have subscription hell. but didn't publishers say the same thing about refunds? difficult times for developersI tried Jenny Clue demo. I really liked it. Will buy once Im done with some other games.
Dev from zeboyd games wrote this on ERA about reselling games on Steam:
Steam should let users resell games, French court rules
But that's patently untrue. On consoles the console itself is DRM. You can't make copies of the disc that work on the console and you can't make digital copies that work either. The license is tied to a user and thus, can be untied and transferred. The current protections against piracy will be...
i'd rather have every game to be DRM-free then having multiple subscription services tbh
Right, I meant what you said basically. I apologize if it came off as me dismissing the possibility of things going bad.
Supply and demand will sort itself out. Valve will put in limitations to make it work with the robust marketplace they already have in place. They have way too much experience with all this shit anyways.
In the end people won't be able to abuse sell games over and over again. Attempts at selling games too cheaply also won't affect prices because the only way that is possible is if too many people are buying said game to begin with. And selling a game means its not in your library anymore so that will allow you to buy the same game again etc. Devs and publishers would just price games slightly higher than what they cost in the used marketplace.
Finished Quake 2: The Reckoning. Next Ground Zero.
The reason why publishers do not like the second-hand market is that they get zero money from it. We could imagine a digital one with a cut. One would have to take into account the number of transactions to see if it is interesting money-wise for the dev/pub.
Besides, if I do not buy a game during the first week, I will wait for a Humble bundle, or maybe a large discount. These days, I could wait for its inclusion in a gamepass. Who knows whether it is better to sell a new copy of the game with a 75% discount, or get several times the transaction cut from a previously sold copy of the game?
As long as devs get a % of the resell money, everything should be fine.
If publishers can complain that piracy is people stealing actual goods from them, then those legit actual goods should be tradable and sellable.
A market that is based on the impossibility for the customer to resell his purchases seems pretty fucked up to me.
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