News Cyberpunk 2077 - releasing December 10 , 2020

Valdien

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Actually, this touches on something I wanted to remark on due to these patch notes.

This:

Is basically a polite way of saying "you imagined that editing some numbers in a file that isn't even used changed performance". Quite a few people imagined it drastically affected performance.

The person who originally wrote about it (with, among other things, the "qualification" that they know what to do with config files since they are a C# programmer; I thought that was quite amusing back then) also implied that CDPR was somehow gimping performance for not doing something so apparently obvious. And lots of people jumped on the bandwagon (just like with the SMT thread count on some Ryzen CPUs, which was first supposed to be missing optimizations due to Intel being evil, until it turned out that it's just code from a library and no Intel compiler is involved; From an AMD library, FWIW).

This is emblematic of the kind of "voodoo+outrage" approach to performance and tuning that I noticed in the gaming community many years ago -- and if anything it's getting worse (I should note that this is really not unique to gaming, I feel like the same thing applies broadly to lots of online discourse). I wish people would use incidents like these to reflect a bit about how quickly they trust random information, and particularly what level of care they expect and demand when generating and presenting performance results.

And since I feel like this kind of opinion is often misunderstood, I want to make really clear that I don't at all feel like only people who have a deep technical background should be discussing performance or even trying to discover improvements or document behaviours. However, if you aren't reasonably sure about your information you should stop short of blaming specific people, technologies or companies, and you should really try to follow best benchmarking practices and double check your results before publishing your findings.
One of my biggest gripe with such behaviour or "PSA my performance improved 20 FPS by doing this" on sites like Reddit and Steam are, is that majority of the time, they never provide any benchmarked results. The person who wrote the memory pool adjustment post made zero attempts to justify his findings or his performance improvement. And I'm supposed to believe that, especially considering the numerous combination of PC specific hardware out there?

Misinformation on Reddit spreads like wildfire, anyway. Steve from Gamer Nexus did a video on this particular problem.
 

Swenhir

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This is emblematic of the kind of "voodoo+outrage" approach to performance and tuning that I noticed in the gaming community many years ago -- and if anything it's getting worse (I should note that this is really not unique to gaming, I feel like the same thing applies broadly to lots of online discourse). I wish people would use incidents like these to reflect a bit about how quickly they trust random information, and particularly what level of care they expect and demand when generating and presenting performance results.

And since I feel like this kind of opinion is often misunderstood, I want to make really clear that I don't at all feel like only people who have a deep technical background should be discussing performance or even trying to discover improvements or document behaviours. However, if you aren't reasonably sure about your information you should stop short of blaming specific people, technologies or companies, and you should really try to follow best benchmarking practices and double check your results before publishing your findings.
Emphasis mine, and I have fallen prey to that shortsighted way of thinking in the past, I won't lie. It's really hard to go past the desire to fit with others in righteous anger. But damn if it isn't hard seeing people who blatantly have not a single fucking idea what they are mouthing off about crucify people who are much, much more experienced than they are. And the one knowledgeable, nuanced voice of the people who know just get crushed under brigading and downvotes.

I wish I had the answer but it doesn't seem to be getting any better. At this point it's like a weather forecast, you just hope the angry masses align in the right direction.

And worse. Sometimes, they are right.
 
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EdwardTivrusky

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GOG Galaxy just updated Cyberpunk and i've no idea how big the patch was as there's 4 of them marked as Patch 1.04 to Patch 1.05 at 9GB in total and the download summary says 9.0GB. No idea if it actually downloaded all of them or just the 1.1GB file.
 

texhnolyze

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Yeah, the memory pool thing was just bullshit/placebo. I was certain that it didn't affect performance at all, and the loading times I mentioned was probably due to the location I was in after applying the tweak. Later I realized that loading times varied depending on your location.

Downloading the patch now, 1.7GB. Just woke up.
 

nordschatten

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Currently wearing Silver Aviators, White Kabuto Helm, Silver and Green Crinkly Top, Pink and Blue Overcoat, Gold Hotpants and Grey and Red Trainers.
I'm dapper as fuck, me.
My guy is dressed like a 5 year old got into his mums clothing cupboard.
My V looks pretty good, I think :)






The secret is not looking at any pre-release media.
Indeed! I think I after the first half-hour gameplay video that showed one of the early missions, I didnt watch anything else.




People, they never stop surprising me.
Indeed... that is weird




Ah finally get the hacking haha, it was the row - col - row - col flow that I did't get at first. Thanks to all who explained it to me! It was the first tutorial on it that put wrong info into my brain that was a block, it made me believe they had to be connected, as in touching, like step by step.
Took me a while too :grimacing-face:




Well, just saw the title card after around 9 hours of play. how long is it for you guys?
16 hours, took most people here quite a while to get there :)




Every time I play I think I'll get over how amazing the atmosphere and visuals are, and every time I fail.

You'd think that after over 30 hours you've built up a resistance to it, and then you suddenly exit from a penthouse to an impeccably designed and lit Japanese-style roof garden and see the lights of the city through the smog far below you, and the neon above you reflected in the glass roofs. Whew.
Yeah I feel the same way. its still all amazing :D And Im not even playing it with any fancy settings. Something I do play via Geforce Now, but usually I just do Low-Medium and I'm fine with it.

~
Edited because I wrote 22 instead of 16 hours to the title screen by mistake.
 

EdwardTivrusky

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At least i don't get bored with my oufits because at level 3 virtually everything i pick up has better stats than what i'm currently wearing so i change my ensemble every 10 minutes it seems. I still look like i fought my way out of a charity shop where all the clothing rails have collapsed on top of me but it's kind of fun. I did find myself wonddering if i should wear a tight dress i'd picked up on my way to go sit in a car with some wannabe big-wig who's sizing me up for a job but then i said nah to that, put on some godawful clothes combo and went exploring while slapping down gang activity. Good times.
 

ISee

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The game makes one thing different than other "RPGs" (I still think open world Deus Ex is more accurate than RPG, but whatever).

It lets you spend time with NPCs on a similar level as RDR 2 did. You talk to them, you learn to know them, you spend mundane time with them. Makes the NPCs you meet on your way feel better. Wish more AAA games would take their time for quiet moments with long dialogues. It's well done.
 

Swenhir

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So I just stumbled back upon the monks with which I've had a conversation about the transferring of consciousness and Buddhism. Pretty interesting stuff, and I'm flabbergasted there was zero icon on the map or minimap to indicate it. Just an NPC hollering at me when I walked by.
 
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Monooboe

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The game makes one thing different than other "RPGs" (I still think open world Deus Ex is more accurate than RPG, but whatever).

It lets you spend time with NPCs on a similar level as RDR 2 did. You talk to them, you learn to know them, you spend mundane time with them. Makes the NPCs you meet on your way feel better. Wish more AAA games would take their time for quiet moments with long dialogues. It's well done.
Yeah I love for example just riding in the car with NPCs, when they drive. Talking with them while looking out of the window and with techno on the radio.
 

Prodigy

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And all I've got so far are one t-pose and a couple of floating phones. Oh, and a character on top of my car/bike appearing and dissapearing while driving. That's pretty funny.
Yeah, I have seen some crazy things on consoles, and you would think that wouldn't differ by platforms. The worst thing I had was Delamain merging in my calls which I see was fixed in the latest patch, otherwise it has been pretty smooth sailing my end.
 

didamangi

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Yeah, I have seen some crazy things on consoles, and you would think that wouldn't differ by platforms. The worst thing I had was Delamain merging in my calls which I see was fixed in the latest patch, otherwise it has been pretty smooth sailing my end.
From my steam activity feed, the game definitely has bugs, even that gamersnexus video shows one. But yeah, not more than the usual bethesda jank so far. the crowd cowering endlessly after a gunfight is one of them. picking up stuff is hilariously more difficult than it should. Just few niggles here and there that's bringing it down a notch.

Other than that it's a pretty good game so far for me. Character building is good. story is interesting enough. combat and gunplay is actually pretty good for a game of this type. blasting shotgun point blank is satisfying. no peashooter feeling here.

Looking at the bugs on console, I can see why console gamers are mad though. The backlash for that is warranted I feel.
 

Spamlynguist

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picking up stuff is hilariously more difficult than it should.
Haha yeah it definitely is. It happens mostly to items that are under corpses or whenever I want to pick up shards but there's a couple items next or in front of it that I have to pick up first.
 
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EdwardTivrusky

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Hmmm, i think 1.05 has rearranged some objects in the database or something in the UI has gone pop. I have had a gun with no image in the inventory, the upgrade screen says "You must reach level {int_0} to upgrade." when i cannot upgrade further, i've seen an item with "DB.Name blah blah blah" instead of item text and guns in my stash say 0 DPS in their stats until i take them out and stash them again.

I haven't duped or exploited anything so i shouldn't have dodgy items which are causing the problem, it's all looted or bought kit.

I've played for about 18 hours but i've done very little in the story at all so i might start a new game to see if that fixes things. I can get to where i am now in about an hour after a restart so it's no big problem. If people have had those issues before then i might just YOLO and continue on.
 
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yuraya

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Every time I play I think I'll get over how amazing the atmosphere and visuals are, and every time I fail.

You'd think that after over 30 hours you've built up a resistance to it, and then you suddenly exit from a penthouse to an impeccably designed and lit Japanese-style roof garden and see the lights of the city through the smog far below you, and the neon above you reflected in the glass roofs. Whew.
The game is so visually addicting. Its the perfect video game for a tourist. The city is so dense its almost impossible to become familiar with most of it. Looking down a street from different angles feels like you are looking at different things. Its like a sensory overload.

The whole thing reminds me of playing Bioshock for the first time. They basically took Bioshock and its visual blitz/immersion...and made a giant open world game with it. Its quite an accomplishment I think the artists/designers at CDPR should demand a raise after releasing this heh.

The sad thing is I don't see any other dev trying to attempt something futuristic like this for a long time. Maybe Rockstar could top this if they do Liberty City with crazy next gen ambition but otherwise most open world games these days are just full of empty fields or 1/2 story buildings.


But yeah after this game, Bethesda has some big shoes to fill for their next game!
I can't wait for Starfield. Even tho it will probably just be Fallout in space. I'm gonna hold out on the small chance its a smart Star Trek like experience or something even more brilliant. I think Todd will bring the big guns for the unveil. I can't wait hopefully its next year.
 

Derrick01

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I chose to hold off playing this until my new PC gets here in early january (which I doubt due to how hard 3080s are to get even for retailers) and I'm torn on that decision. On the plus side it's absurdly good looking on that highest end, but on the other hand it seems like that's all this game really has. I usually try to avoid discussion on a game before I play it as I don't want to be influenced but the hype from this has made it hard to avoid. The thing I know is going to really hurt the game for me is how dead the world is. Graphics are nice and all but the world is more static than mafia 2 was and the NPC and cop behavior is more basic than gta 3 (yes, THREE).

I started watching this a couple hours ago and it hits so many things that I've seen people say as well as some newer ones to my eyes, like yes there are multiple paths to objectives but they tend to be very close to each other which is something that's always bugged me from games that claim to offer choice yet miss on this very basic element to immersive sim design.

 

ISee

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Another side mission (without story). This time a bit longer, with more hacking etc.
And while my gameplay still sucks and I mess up near the end and need to rush to my target before it escapes: I think the similarities to Deus Ex are more easy to spot here.

 

yuraya

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I kind of see why they didn't bother going the 3rd person camera route for this game. Back to the Bioshock comparison...playing this game in 3rd person would be like playing Bioshock in 3rd person. A lot of the immersion would be lost because you pay more attention to your character than the world. Not to mention all the FPS/Melee gameplay would just be weird and janky in 3rd person. Kind of like a Fallout/ElderScrolls game.

Unless they iron out all the 3rd person player views/animations..I also don't see how they release a multiplayer mode for this game. Especially not a GTAV grindfest mmo type of mode. Maybe some type of competitive shooter or something would work.


I chose to hold off playing this until my new PC gets here in early january (which I doubt due to how hard 3080s are to get even for retailers) and I'm torn on that decision. On the plus side it's absurdly good looking on that highest end, but on the other hand it seems like that's all this game really has. I usually try to avoid discussion on a game before I play it as I don't want to be influenced but the hype from this has made it hard to avoid. The thing I know is going to really hurt the game for me is how dead the world is. Graphics are nice and all but the world is more static than mafia 2 was and the NPC and cop behavior is more basic than gta 3 (yes, THREE).
If you go in expecting GTA 2077 then you will most likely be disappointed. I think its better for people to go in wanting Witcher 2077 or Deus Ex 2077.

Don't get me wrong this game takes and does a lot of things from GTA games but it doesn't commit to them like Rockstar does.

At the same time this game does a ton of things Rockstar has never attempted to do with their games so its not like some try hard GTA clone. It is its own beast. CDPR plays to their strengths with this for sure.
 

ISee

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Second time I'm hearing that hit detection is "laggy", never experienced that myself but maybe I'm not observant enough,

AI is fundamental, I agree with that but looking how the game is already eating away CPU resources and even people with modern 6c/12t CPUs like the 5600x, 10600k are running into CPU bottlenecks. Maybe cutting down on "world simulation AI" was necessary? I don't know.

And yes, Rockstar is doing the "living, breathing" world a lot better, especially in RDR 2.
But as yuraya said: This isn't a Rockstar Clone, this is a modernized open world Deus Ex. The play as you want approach is deeper here and while some levels could be wider (imo), comparing CP 2077 and GTA is as accurate as comparing AC:Valhalla and RDR 2. They are open world games, but different ones with different goals.

The game and story is focused on the characters you meet on your way. Sounds like a trite statement, but the game is about "V" and the personal drama surrounding him/her. And that Drama is good, your "companions" are better illuminated than in Mass Effect and especially than in GTA.
It's still Cyberpunk fiction, so it can be over the top sometimes, even has to be imo. That doesn't change that there is some excellent stuff in there.

Bugs are present and they can throw you out of the fiction; even be distracting. But I've not seen anything like in the "console" (?) videos floating around: V is sometimes T-posing while driving, police is terrible, lips are sometimes not moving and there are some wanky car physics.

If the game would be running at acceptable performance levels on PS4, Xbox (30 fps, 95%) the internet critique would be less harsh. People gave FO4, FO76, Oblivion, Skyrim, AC:Unity, No Man's Sky a pass. And those games were more of a mess than CP 2077 at launch. Average performance is the big difference. Fair enough and while the game is clearly in need of improvement on PC, it is fine :shrugblob:
(Unless the savegame corruption thing is true).

The graphics are helping to mitigate that a lot for me though.
I briefly started WD_Legion yesterday and my brain was screaming that it looked flat and uninteresting. While I'm still riding my bike to every mission in CP 2077 because: :oops:
 
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texhnolyze

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Yeah, people keep focusing on the comparison with Rockstar games, but they tend to ignore the fact that there are a lot of things in Cyberpunk that Rockstar haven't done and never do in their games. They're totally different games with different focus.

Also, I never consider Rockstar games as the definition of having a "living & breathing" world where 99% of the buildings are inaccessible and the NCPs are just nobody that are randomly spawned. I still consider Bethesda RPGs as the best in this part. You are part of the world, with named characters that have their own lives, with towns and buildings as well as items that actually have ownership.
 

Joe Spangle

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Yeah I think its best to view CP77 as a linear story driven game that happens to have a big city setting that you can mooch about it if you like. Its visuals and Story are the best elements. Everything is fair standard video game stuff. Its not the next leap in gaming as perhaps the marketing hype would like to believe but it is fun. I only bought it as I have a free couple of weeks over xmas, otherwise i would probably wait maybe 6 months for patches.
 
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Durante

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I honestly really don't understand why anyone would watch videos dedicated to finding problems (real, imagined or expectation-based) with a game.

I first encountered that phenomenon with Dark Souls 2 (one of my favourite games of all time, incidentally), and I didn't understand it back then either. I guess it ultimately drives engagement in a similar underlying psychological manner as negative content does on social networks.

Edit: let me amend that -- anyone who isn't a game designer trying to improve their craft. But even those would probably much rather listen to e.g. a GDC retrospective than a random Youtuber.
 

Derrick01

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If you go in expecting GTA 2077 then you will most likely be disappointed. I think its better for people to go in wanting Witcher 2077 or Deus Ex 2077.

Don't get me wrong this game takes and does a lot of things from GTA games but it doesn't commit to them like Rockstar does.

At the same time this game does a ton of things Rockstar has never attempted to do with their games so its not like some try hard GTA clone. It is its own beast. CDPR plays to their strengths with this for sure.
Other than the completely absent NPC AI that's the only comparison to GTA I would make. Otherwise for years leading up to this game I was kind of hoping/expecting a new vegas contender as they kept announcing things like a skill system, multiple ways to do quests etc though I was extremely skeptical they could do it because...well they've never tried to make a game like that before now. That's mostly where my disappointment lies with what I've seen of the game.
 
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rybrad

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I honestly really don't understand why anyone would watch videos dedicated to finding problems (real, imagined or expectation-based) with a game.

I first encountered that phenomenon with Dark Souls 2 (one of my favourite games of all time, incidentally), and I didn't understand it back then either. I guess it ultimately drives engagement in a similar underlying psychological manner as negative content does on social networks.

Edit: let me amend that -- anyone who isn't a game designer trying to improve their craft. But even those would probably much rather listen to e.g. a GDC retrospective than a random Youtuber.
I thought everyone hated Dark Souls 2 except me and my buddy; it was our favorite one for solo NG and coop NG+. I feel like people have a lot of hero worship issues with certain industry icons/devs which leads to polarizing opinions for dumb reasons and seeking "supporting" material on their opinions.

On topic for Cyberpunk, I haven't had a ton of issues with the game but I think I am going to wait for the February patch now and see what happens. I only play games this length once so I might as well wait a little bit to see how it improves.
 
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Durante

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Other than the completely absent NPC AI that's the only comparison to GTA I would make. Otherwise for years leading up to this game I was kind of hoping/expecting a new vegas contender as they kept announcing things like a skill system, multiple ways to do quests etc though I was extremely skeptical they could do it because...well they've never tried to make a game like that before now. That's mostly where my disappoint lies with what I've seen of the game.
It has quite a lot of quests which have multiple ways to do them, but it is true that none I encountered so far match the best (or even "average good") New Vegas had to offer. On the other hand, that's a rather high bar. The commonly posted -- for good reason -- flow chart of the White Glove quest in NV isn't really matched by the majority of quests in NV itself either.

That said, as I posted before if there was a single thing I could point to and have improved in 2077 then I would choose to provide more dialogue-based approaches in more quests. Unlike many of the other criticism I read that one actually does apply to the way I play the game.

I thought everyone hated Dark Souls 2 except me and my buddy; it was our favorite one for solo NG and coop NG+. I feel like people have a lot of hero worship issues with certain industry icons/devs which leads to polarizing opinions for dumb reasons and seeking "supporting" material on their opinions.
When I talk to people about the Souls games I feel like overall those who are more into NG+ and co-op/multiplayer tend to look more favorably at DS2. It's not a 100% rule obviously but there's certainly a correlation.
 
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Swenhir

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I do enjoy skill checks whenever I come across them but there are far and few, unfortunately. This drives me to take skills mostly out of roleplaying/playstyle priorities, taking mostly TA in order to unlock doors. I'm not sure how high I'll raise Cool, for example, given how little dialogue relies on it.
 
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Joe Spangle

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I had to do a long mission, about 45mins with this annoying bug - A noisy guitar riff just looping over and over again. Couldn't save and re-load as the mission was combat/story. Definitely a bug as it was playing over dialogue and important moody cut scenes. Continued once id finished the mission and was back in the city. Once i saved and re-loaded it stopped.

Its now stuck in my head and has been all night