apparently they were expecting volvo to do all the marketing for them
News Epic Games Store
- Thread starter Blizniak
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Sidebar, but I've personally never seen what's so "amazing" about Playdead's games.
Got Limbo in one of the first Humble Bundles and played through it.
Cool art style, but the gameplay was entirely dependent on "gotcha" fail moments, where stuff happens that you have no way of knowing beforehand, then replaying the same section until you learn how to proceed.
So when Inside appeared and was hailed to be so revolutionary, I was immediately sceptic.
It seems to be the exact same puzzle platforming with a nice art style as Limbo, but with a "deep" story (that is left unspoken or some such?) and a tacked on body-horror ending.
And this was apparently hailed as the most deep and impressive thing ever?
Apparently the Playdead games are not for me...
Got Limbo in one of the first Humble Bundles and played through it.
Cool art style, but the gameplay was entirely dependent on "gotcha" fail moments, where stuff happens that you have no way of knowing beforehand, then replaying the same section until you learn how to proceed.
So when Inside appeared and was hailed to be so revolutionary, I was immediately sceptic.
It seems to be the exact same puzzle platforming with a nice art style as Limbo, but with a "deep" story (that is left unspoken or some such?) and a tacked on body-horror ending.
And this was apparently hailed as the most deep and impressive thing ever?
Apparently the Playdead games are not for me...
Limbo had advantage of being a forerunner in atmospheric platformer I think. Same reason why people would look at Half-life or Amnesia and think they're nothing special, not realizing the fact that they inspired the deluge of other similar games.
They probably heard of other Japanese developers having success on Steam and assumed it was a goldmine. Then reality bit them and it transpired that they had to do some work like, ya know, promote their game.
I'm sure you've all gathered by the tone of my last few posts that I'm not too fond of SNK. I really don't know why. I just really dislike them.
That's stupid, but I could believe it.
Still, it looks like this isn't official news but just a fansite posting unconfirmed rumors.
Taking these conditions listed at face value, that publishing deal is GREAT. Not "decent", not "fairly good". It's genuinely great.
Usually if you can EVER land a deal where 100% of your development will get funded upfront, you can absolutely forget about keeping the IP or getting anything more than a 10% of the profits as royalties after costs are recouped.
The fact that it comes from Epic and it will imply exclusivity to their shitty service is a bummer for customers, but in all honesty if I was a studio I'd take the deal in a heartbeat because there's nothing even remotely comparable around.
Ismail is a tool and a massive Timmy Tencent stan since Epic launched their initiative, but he's not entirely wrong there. Whoever claims it's a poor deal doesn't have a clue.
If anything it may be almost TOO GOOD to be viable, since it assumes everything will be fine and these games will turn out decent sellers.
Epic may be on its way to learn some harsh reality about why the other publishers aren't so generous, about the unreliable nature of software development for certain studios and how many times these studios will go over budget and fail to meet deadlines before a final release.
Usually if you can EVER land a deal where 100% of your development will get funded upfront, you can absolutely forget about keeping the IP or getting anything more than a 10% of the profits as royalties after costs are recouped.
The fact that it comes from Epic and it will imply exclusivity to their shitty service is a bummer for customers, but in all honesty if I was a studio I'd take the deal in a heartbeat because there's nothing even remotely comparable around.
Ismail is a tool and a massive Timmy Tencent stan since Epic launched their initiative, but he's not entirely wrong there. Whoever claims it's a poor deal doesn't have a clue.
If anything it may be almost TOO GOOD to be viable, since it assumes everything will be fine and these games will turn out decent sellers.
Epic may be on its way to learn some harsh reality about why the other publishers aren't so generous, about the unreliable nature of software development for certain studios and how many times these studios will go over budget and fail to meet deadlines before a final release.
But that's the whole problem. If Epic pays for full development, you're very in the hole. You owe them all that money back. If you can't sell outside of Epic store, you'll possibly never see a cent of profit because Epic will recover their development costs first, plus 50% forever afterward. If you're stuck on EGS, how can you actually get paid after the game releases?
Console releases.
And starting right away with the next 100% epic funded game.
Maybe. Still Playdead must be nearly Realdead if they wouldn't rather self-publish. But who knows. I was looking forward to their next game.
In a time when even console exclusives are looking to head to PC, this Epic ecosystem is looking more and more wrongheaded.
I mean, it feels like you are somehow missing the point, which is what everyone else offers in comparison:
when someone takes all the risks on his shoulders and pays you 100% of your development budget upfront, talking 50% of the profits after [eventually] breaking-even isn't something to mourn. It's a big fucking bonus.
And even if you don't reach the break-even point (which isi anything but guaranteed, especially if you went over-budget during production) you have the safenet anyway.
I can assure you that no matter how many devs you'll ask, you won't hear anyone who will point you a publisher offering better conditions.
That's not to say I'm happy Epic is the one funding these studios, but let's not be in denial of how good of a offering this is.
And frankly this is a type of strategy I've hoped in the past to see from Valve, because they were in the perfect spot to attempt this first.
Too bad this time they've been soundly beaten about being first to a great idea.
Yeah, and what about post-release support like patches? Is this included in the full cost covering or does the studio need to finance it themselves? With what money? Unless they have a major success that gets them money on day1, they are looking for months without any income.
- what happens with failed projects? Can they start on a new game or have to continue on the project they don't believe anymore and don't find the solution to make it work?
- retaining the IP means jack shit if you are dependent on Epic paying your bills. How would you work on your own IP after getting away from epic if you don't get paid for months?
- retaining the IP also means jack shit for Remedy who never ever made a game (to my knowledge) without having a publisher and an exclusive deal. They never were so brave as to do a Larian Studios and develop an IP and release a game without a major publisher.
I mean, no shit? it's not like many devs have hid this. it's nice to see them not add on to that thought with 'which is better for you, the gamers' though
Good that he clarifies that's the heart of the matter. After all, everything else is an externality when it comes to money
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So, Epic is basically choosing some devs (the top end that didn't really need help in getting investors and funding, it's not like they'll give Random Joe 10 million to create his dream game with out any historical guarantee of ever making that money back or completing the project) to loan money to in return for exclusivity, ie all 50% sale profits they wouldn't otherwise get, and they're getting it all for free since any funds they give up front have to be recouped first before the dev sees another dime. And people say they wanted Valve to do this? What? Valve is hands off and provides an open platform as another option for anyone and everyone, publisher and indie, why want them more involved in others' business? If these guys got a loan from someone else they'd have to give interest on top but not limit their game to any single platform or for giving back the loan up front from their sales. If they got it from crowd funding they wouldn't even have to return anything. Etc. So, yes, some devs are getting a nice loan with good terms in return for that freedom. It's not some paradigm shift, just a twist on what Epic's already been doing, pretending to give money they always calculate to be able to recoup and get free exclusivity and other bonuses. The real nice thing would be to fund the game and recoup their costs from the 12% rather than get 100% until they achieve that, much like paying your loan monthly, sans interest (which can be considered to be the 12% they get from only having it on their platform). Or to ask for a monthly interest but not force them into using EGS alone.
It's still a good thing that will make some other publishers more likely to offer better deals to compete (more control of the game/IP remaining to the devs, more chances for revenue sharing rather than just keeping it all in return for funding it or giving bonuses based on sales, whatever they do instead) but it's not like they can copy Epic's model exactly as they don't all have their own store. And this has nothing to do with Steam/Valve, just third party publishers, ie, those that have their own dev teams and/or contract other dev studios to do their bidding as their business. Ie, they now compete with Annapurna who was so quick to support them, it would be nice if all their collaborators just go to Epic for their next game but sadly Epic isn't even gonna get all of them onboard. Even in Control dev's case the ideal scenario would be to have made enough money to not need a publisher for funds so have true full freedom. Clearly it didn't.
It's still a good thing that will make some other publishers more likely to offer better deals to compete (more control of the game/IP remaining to the devs, more chances for revenue sharing rather than just keeping it all in return for funding it or giving bonuses based on sales, whatever they do instead) but it's not like they can copy Epic's model exactly as they don't all have their own store. And this has nothing to do with Steam/Valve, just third party publishers, ie, those that have their own dev teams and/or contract other dev studios to do their bidding as their business. Ie, they now compete with Annapurna who was so quick to support them, it would be nice if all their collaborators just go to Epic for their next game but sadly Epic isn't even gonna get all of them onboard. Even in Control dev's case the ideal scenario would be to have made enough money to not need a publisher for funds so have true full freedom. Clearly it didn't.
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Lots of devs are gonna be disappointed if they realize that Epic won't publish their game at these terms.
They'll eventually turn on Epic just like they did with Steam. They refuse to accept that these deals are not sustainable.
Doesn't seem to include any guaranteed sales deal like previous epic signatures. 50% of pitiful sales revenue minus the 2nd epic tax on Epic is still pitiful.
I actually missed that 50% bit, I edited my post. I thought they'd revert to the 12% EGS publishing deal after recouping costs. This deal now sounds horrible to me. How long are they locked to EGS exclusivity with this and/or how long do they give 50% for regardless of store used (then again who will want to give 50% to Epic and then another storefront's fee on top)? Forever? And if it's forever then how do they consider devs still own their game going on about their freedom and shit? The IP, I get it, they could make a sequel without Epic, but the specific game? I guess if you wanna go AAA without concept concessions to suit the publisher and Epic is willing with amounts you can't easily get outside a big publisher/first party like SEGA or Sony, it might be better, but for anyone else it seems to give up too much? Wouldn't others rather make some smaller games to profit off of and hopefully raise funds to make their bigger non AAA dream games, crowd fund them, or get an actual loan with a given interest and no lifetime obligation to give 50% of all the profits? That last may be riskier but come on, Epic will choose the least risky endeavors itself, if Epic does choose you, you should know you've likely got a hit in your hands as they obviously calculate risks to accept so maybe look elsewhere to get the money and release your game with more benefits for yourself rather than giving all 50% to Epic.
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Who knows? They haven't been at all transparent about timescales of things up until now. I'd be surprised if they weren't developing it, but development of the store seems to be going at a glacial pace as it is, so expect all features TBD until actually released.
Terrific. Frankly, if you fail or refuse to see both sides of this matter (devs and their customers) and post something this stupid, you're doing your part in turning the indie scene, which was often based on trust and good will towards the developers (with the belief that they were most likely nice people and not at all like those assholes at insert your favorite big evil corporation here), into a war between factions. If you don't see how this might hurt your fellow indie developers you claim to speak for, you're clueless... if you do see it and don't care because 'fuck you got mine', well... you know what you are.
Managed to play 1 match in Predator: Huunting Grounds. Even with crossplay enabled it took me forever to find a match and the game is really rough and I really dislike the climbing controls.
Real shame cause I really like the Aliens and Predators universe.
Pretty much all negative impressions everywhere.
So I guess Sony releasing it on EGS is just a cash-grab for Sony.
Real shame cause I really like the Aliens and Predators universe.
Pretty much all negative impressions everywhere.
So I guess Sony releasing it on EGS is just a cash-grab for Sony.
I don't believe any negative impressions. Epic handpicks only the best of the best.
Egs has always been all about quality and building a curated store that makes every purchase a highly valuable one. None of that Steam tripe! That's why it doesn't need user reviews, because every game is a little gem that just needs to be appreciated and bought with complete confidence. Actually, they want you to appreciate each and every one so much that you can only buy one at a time. You are fortunate they even allow you to experience the brilliance of their work.
It looks like Mount & Blade II: Bannerlords was delayed on EGS:
www.epicgames.com
It's now listed as Spring 2020.
Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord | Download and Buy Today - Epic Games Store
Download and play Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord at the Epic Games Store. Check for platform availability and price!
www.epicgames.com
It's now listed as Spring 2020.
Timed Steam exclusive. Competition!It looks like Mount & Blade II: Bannerlords was delayed on EGS:
Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord | Download and Buy Today - Epic Games Store
Download and play Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord at the Epic Games Store. Check for platform availability and price!
It's now listed as Spring 2020.
Yet another smash hit for Epic. Imagine using your timed exclusive moneybags for games like this.
I received a Switch review code for the game, played a few min before I quit. The concept is great, but the execution is not. Might get back to it later to give it a second chance.
I received a Switch review code for the game, played a few min before I quit. The concept is great, but the execution is not. Might get back to it later to give it a second chance.
They didn't add client icon even or cloud saves. You'd think those would be easy.
they are easy to add ... on steam
They didn't add client icon even or cloud saves. You'd think those would be easy.
on egs - probably not so much
You bought it?
They didn't add client icon even or cloud saves. You'd think those would be easy.
Totally Reliable Delivery Service is free on Epic Store until march 8th.
Nice to know that you never have to buy an indie game on the Epic Store.
Nice to know that you never have to buy an indie game on the Epic Store.
Everything to prevent disappointment from devs going EGS exclusive I guess. Game would have bombed hard.
Sources: Despite Huge Sales, Borderlands 3 Developers Are Getting Stiffed On Bonuses
But but but the developers!!!!
But but but the developers!!!!
People working under Randy Pitchford while he's being investigated for embezzlement not getting paid what they're owed? No way.
This is truly a shocking turn of events. What a shame.
who could've seen that coming? i'm shocked!
Well I payed 50% off after waiting 6 months. Would have bought it full price if it released day 1 on Steam.
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It doesn't matter if you give or not give your money to asshole Devs. They ll end up screwing their workers one way or the other.
The only winning move is not to pay.
The only winning move is not to pay.
Randy is a whole other level of bad. He not only takes his frustrations out of his legion of naysayers (us), he takes it out on his own employees. He's a snake oil sales man with the outfits to boot.
Besides Randy being such a 'nice' person, this is why I don't believe that the moneyhats benefit the devs unless they outright say that it does.