Community MetaSteam | March 2024 - Can we find Moominvalley in the Forbidden West?

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fantomena

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Dec 17, 2018
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Decided to play Unicorn Overlord on Ryu whenever I find time for it (unless it goes on sale on console before I find time for it)

If Vanilleware doesn't want me to buy the game on PC (and Im not interested in playing it on my PS5 or Switch currently), then so be it.
 

kio

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Apr 19, 2019
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I'll throw a bit more fuel to the fire, especially consider the tastes of the majority of the people in here and the fast approaching sequel release.

Dragons Dogma is a terrible game. It's full of half backed and broken systems that are held together with gum and string. None of it works as intended and the cult following it has is one of gaming's biggest mysteries. The world is bland, boring and barren, the story is basically non-existent and nonsensical, the combat is repetitive and the enemies boil down to health sponges. I can see the good intentions and ideas the team had and how they could work together to make a good game but the execution is severally lacking. It's a 5/10 game at best.
 

Lashley

My ho ho hoes 🎅
I'll throw a bit more fuel to the fire, especially consider the tastes of the majority of the people in here and the fast approaching sequel release.

Dragons Dogma is a terrible game. It's full of half backed and broken systems that are held together with gum and string. None of it works as intended and the cult following it has is one of gaming's biggest mysteries. The world is bland, boring and barren, the story is basically non-existent and nonsensical, the combat is repetitive and the enemies boil down to health sponges. I can see the good intentions and ideas the team had and how they could work together to make a good game but the execution is severally lacking. It's a 5/10 game at best.
Yeah, it's good ideas that don't come together very well.

I really hope the sequel improves upon that.
 

Li Kao

It’s a strange world. Let’s keep it that way.
Jan 28, 2019
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I'm really really stupid to not play light games on Desktop Deck. The silence is just incredible, and as I'm typing I can say I'm still not accustomed to it. Something feels off.

Re: Dragons Dogma
Didn't play the first game, kinda planning to try it soon to see what people find in it, but looking at gameplay videos of the second one... combats look incredibly boring. I skimmed through one video where they fought cyclops, just skimmed ! And by the end of it I was just sick of the spongyness of the monster.
 

Derrick01

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Oct 6, 2018
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Hitman Absolution too
(except in that case it's a great game in a mediocre otherwise franchise)
Now you guys are trying to troll me.

The game was so bad the devs unveiled the 2016 game with a freakin apology letter to the fans. That's never happened before.
I'll throw a bit more fuel to the fire, especially consider the tastes of the majority of the people in here and the fast approaching sequel release.

Dragons Dogma is a terrible game. It's full of half backed and broken systems that are held together with gum and string. None of it works as intended and the cult following it has is one of gaming's biggest mysteries. The world is bland, boring and barren, the story is basically non-existent and nonsensical, the combat is repetitive and the enemies boil down to health sponges. I can see the good intentions and ideas the team had and how they could work together to make a good game but the execution is severally lacking. It's a 5/10 game at best.
Dunno about terrible but yeah it's a deeply flawed and overrated game. What's so baffling to me is the sequel looks exactly the same to me, they don't seem to have put more effort into the RPG side.
 

Li Kao

It’s a strange world. Let’s keep it that way.
Jan 28, 2019
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Damn, I am looking at installing Mullvad VPN on Deck and... those are words, alright :anguished-face:
 

Gelf

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Apr 22, 2019
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Here's a take that everyone is going to kill me for... but EVERY linear game is a disservice to gaming as a medium.:coffee-blob:
For me there's linear and then there's LINEAR. I'm fine if there a set path through the game I just tend not to like noticing how railroaded my experience is. I feel like it was at it's worst in the early HD PS360 era. Those things where struggling so much for resources that so many games were incredibly focused on corridors and blocking off any route behind you at every moment so you had no feeling of exploration at all. Some managed to hide it better than others though but I hate the feeling that your fighting the game if you dare try to do anything "off script". It's what I assume The Stanley Parable is a parody of.
 

Censored

I didn't delete that post!. Get my post back!.
Oct 8, 2021
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I think this indie game page isn't -still- on Steam but looks really cool

NIGHTMARE OPERATOR

 

Dandy

Bad at Games.
Apr 17, 2019
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Controversial Sunday, huh?

Every few years I will pick up a JRPG and quickly remember that for me, they lack what I enjoy most in RPGs -- player agency. I don't need branching narratives and multiple endings to be happy(though I do appreciate them!), but even the illusion of my choices and actions affecting the story would be nice.

Though I'm willing to admit that maybe I just haven't played the right JRPGs.
 

crimsonheadGCN

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Here's a hot take: I don't think CD Projekt has made a good game and I get bored of their games after 3-4 hours of playing them.

ANother: I prefer live service and multiplayer games over single player ones.

Hitman Absolution too
(except in that case it's a great game in a mediocre otherwise franchise)
I agree. For me, Absolution was the only good Hitman. It was also one of the few games that I tried to beat at the harder difficulty levels.
 

Paul

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Jan 26, 2019
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It boggles my mind that those games are so beloved that 25 years later (!!!!) many people are still spending ungodly amounts of their free time making total conversion mods and/or reimplementing the engine / reimplementing the game mechanics in another engine, but nobody has actually made a commercial product that genuinely competes with it.
I would say Dishonored series scratched similar itch, but I get your point, there is nothing quite like Thief in commercial sphere and even Dishonored 2 is now almost decade old.

Here's a hot take: I don't think CD Projekt has made a good game and I get bored of their games after 3-4 hours of playing them.

ANother: I prefer live service and multiplayer games over single player ones.

I agree. For me, Absolution was the only good Hitman. It was also one of the few games that I tried to beat at the harder difficulty levels.
Amazing. I couldn't disagree harder about literally everything you just wrote if I tried :)
 

fantomena

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Here's a hot take: I don't think CD Projekt has made a good game and I get bored of their games after 3-4 hours of playing them.

ANother: I prefer live service and multiplayer games over single player ones.



I agree. For me, Absolution was the only good Hitman. It was also one of the few games that I tried to beat at the harder difficulty levels.
Those are not hot takes

More like act of war or crimes against humanity.
 

rickyson33

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Apr 26, 2019
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Controversial Sunday, huh?

Every few years I will pick up a JRPG and quickly remember that for me, they lack what I enjoy most in RPGs -- player agency. I don't need branching narratives and multiple endings to be happy(though I do appreciate them!), but even the illusion of my choices and actions affecting the story would be nice.

Though I'm willing to admit that maybe I just haven't played the right JRPGs.
I kinda feel the opposite to be honest, that whole "make your own story" thing doesn't appeal to me and I don't like how it tends to make the main character not really feel like a character

I do still play CRPGs sometimes though, BG3 was probably my favorite game last year
 

rickyson33

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I don't know how much of a hot take this is but I played the first two Atelier games that got released on Steam(Sophie and Firis) and liked them well enough but then lost all interest when they stopped doing dubs and haven't played any since


edit: I played the first Witcher game a decade or so ago and overall liked it even though it was kinda janky at times but never could get into the second one primarily because the isometric camera mode being gone felt too jarring
 
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Gelf

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I only ever played the first Thief but I abandoned it fairly early on because I was really bad at the stealth and I despised the combat, especially with none human enemies. I actually wonder if the rebooted game would be more my thing.

I love a lot of immersive sims but I find a lot of the early stuff awkward to play. I also have issues with the original Deus Ex, which I also was never able to finish. But I love Human Revolution and Mankind Divided.
 
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Sobatronix

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No one is going to badmouth the Hitman franchise on my watch :pouting-face:.

Maybe not all Hitman games are 10/10 but they've been consistently good since their first game. And is the only stealth focus franchise that's still around and alive. Hitman Blood Money is an absolute gem of a video game, and the fun a creative ways you have to take out you targets makes it extremely replayable. The current Hitman trilogy is also among the most impressive and well design stealth games out there.


In other notes, RE5 Remake announcement appears to be closer. If Capcom wants to continue the good steak they need to change that game in a major way.
 

Dragon1893

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Apr 17, 2019
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Shit, Plague Tale looks amazing on the Deck's OLED. That contrast between pitch black shadow and bright fire looks fantastic. I've played through it twice on a LCD and feel like it's the first time I'm seeing it how it's supposed to be seen.
And the game holds up so well visually, the textures and materials still look really good.
God, I love this game so much.
 

Gamall Wednesday Ida

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I only ever played the first Thief but I abandoned it fairly early on because I was really bad at the stealth and I despised the combat, especially with none human enemies.
It's a pure stealth game; if you have aggro on you your objective is never to fight, but to disengage and disappear, and you have tools to do that. Garrett sucks at melee; he's a master thief, not a master warrior.

I actually wonder if the rebooted game would be more my thing.
I don't think so. That's one thing that Thi4f got right: "Garrett" has a small dagger, not a sword, and is as bad at melee as the original.

Despite its missteps, the 2014 reboot is still a pure stealth game, so if you didn't enjoy that aspect in the original, I don't think you'll enjoy it any more there.
 
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Durante

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Oct 21, 2018
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Dragons Dogma is a terrible game. It's full of half backed and broken systems that are held together with gum and string. None of it works as intended and the cult following it has is one of gaming's biggest mysteries. The world is bland, boring and barren, the story is basically non-existent and nonsensical, the combat is repetitive and the enemies boil down to health sponges. I can see the good intentions and ideas the team had and how they could work together to make a good game but the execution is severally lacking. It's a 5/10 game at best.
I don't really disagree that Dragon's Dogma had a lot of issues.

But it also did some things extremely well, and for me personally a game that does one (or a few) things extremely well and/or in a novel way (and is not completely broken elsewhere) is often a lot more enjoyable than a game which does lots of things well but doesn't stand out in any aspect.

One of the things Dragon's Dogma excelled at was spellcasting. We've had decades of fantasy videogames in which you could play as a wizard or sorcerer of sorts, and in all that time nothing implemented a combination of presentation and gameplay integration of casting spells in battle that was as effective as what Dragon's Dogma did.
 

Dandy

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I kinda feel the opposite to be honest, that whole "make your own story" thing doesn't appeal to me and I don't like how it tends to make the main character not really feel like a character

I do still play CRPGs sometimes though, BG3 was probably my favorite game last year
I love creating my own character but I can still enjoy games with pre-set protagonists. In Witcher 3, you play as Geralt but you still decide how he behaves, how much of an asshole he is, how quests resolve, who he has a relationship with, etc... As the player, I just want to have some input in the story -- even if it's just an illusion that changes nothing. That does not exist in any JRPGs I've played. At least that I can remember, anyway.
 
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Hektor

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Nov 1, 2018
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I love creating my own character but I can still enjoy games with pre-set protagonists. In Witcher 3, you play as Geralt but you still decide how he behaves, how much of an asshole he is, how quests resolve, who he has a relationship with, etc... As the player, I just want to have some input in the story -- even if it's just an illusion that changes nothing. That does not exist in any JRPGs I've played. At least that I can remember, anyway.
Now here is my controversial opinion for the day, but i find these RPG protagonists to be easily the worst of them all.

Either give me full control like in most CRPG's, OR give me a completely pre-written character like in most JRPG's.

Character like Geralt or the protagonists of Persona games, just don't work for me at all, where you have a largely defined characters, i find it impossible to utilize dialogue choices. It feels like Anti-Roleplaying, where there's 3 choices in a dialogue. 2 Wrong ones, and the one Geralt would actually make.
 
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ZKenir

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May 10, 2019
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i'm fine with anything provided i'm in the right mood
 

Mivey

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One of the things Dragon's Dogma excelled at was spellcasting. We've had decades of fantasy videogames in which you could play as a wizard or sorcerer of sorts, and in all that time nothing implemented a combination of presentation and gameplay integration of casting spells in battle that was as effective as what Dragon's Dogma did.
I played Dragon's Dogma last year, and I was looking forward to spell casting in this game, and I was left a bit mifffed. The spells look cool, but the novelty of the animations wears of quick, and you are left with spells that are just one-off effects. You can't combine spells, you only get a couple obvious versions for each and since you can only bind 3 (if you are multi-class like i was) or at most 6, you will probably keep using the same few spells the entire game, which further makes spellcasting feel repetitive.

It's not bad system (though I found playing as a pure mage to be pretty bad in terms of balancing early on) , but I didn't understand what about it should be so impressive. Overall, my impression of Dragon's Dogma was of a interesting game, in many ways I get the impression it wants to be highly systemic and almost immersive sim like in terms of player freedom, but just falls short in making a game that ever really works well.
 

Arulan

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Now here is my controversial opinion for the day, but i find these RPG protagonists to be easily the worst of them all.

Either give me full control like in most CRPG's, OR give me a completely pre-written character like in most JRPG's.

Character like Geralt or the protagonists of Persona games, just don't work for me at all, where you have a largely defined characters, i find it impossible to utilize dialogue choices. It feels like Anti-Roleplaying, where there's 3 choices in a dialogue. 2 Wrong ones, and the one Geralt would actually make.
While I strongly prefer creating a character, in large part because it reinforces character agency through reactivity, there is a recent standout that isn't quite in either camp. What do you think about Detective Raphaël Ambrosius Costeau aka Harrier Du Bois?
 
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Gelf

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It's a pure stealth game; if you have aggro on you your objective is never to fight, but to disengage and disappear, and you have tools to do that. Garrett sucks at melee; he's a master thief, not a master warrior.


I don't think so. That's one thing that Thi4f got right: "Garrett" has a small dagger, not a sword, and is as bad at melee as the original.

Despite its missteps, the 2014 reboot is still a pure stealth game, so if you didn't enjoy that aspect in the original, I don't think you'll enjoy it any more there.
I don't mind something being a pure stealth game at all, I've beaten plenty in my time and if given the option I almost always pick stealth first in any game. I just really struggled to do it in that game specifically when I played it, albeit a long time ago now. I can't remember specifics too well but i think I was in some underground area and I just could not avoid aggroing the creatures down there, the fact I thought I actually had to fight them probably says a lot about how poorly I was doing. I hated that area so much and dropped the game.

Like I said I seem to have a problem with a lot of early first person games. Maybe I coped better when they started to be tailored more for controllers, something I assume Thi4f is also.
 
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Arulan

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I'll throw a bit more fuel to the fire, especially consider the tastes of the majority of the people in here and the fast approaching sequel release.

Dragons Dogma is a terrible game. It's full of half backed and broken systems that are held together with gum and string. None of it works as intended and the cult following it has is one of gaming's biggest mysteries. The world is bland, boring and barren, the story is basically non-existent and nonsensical, the combat is repetitive and the enemies boil down to health sponges. I can see the good intentions and ideas the team had and how they could work together to make a good game but the execution is severally lacking. It's a 5/10 game at best.
As someone who just played it last month for the first time I don't agree. It does have a lot of systems that aren't full realized, but as a whole work well enough together. All said, I thought it was a great action RPG.

The (exterior) world for example isn't very compelling to explore in isolation, as you might in an Elder Scrolls game, but it works well in tandem with the limited fast-travel (unless you're using the Eternal Ferrystone added in Dark Arisen, which arguably should have never been added), the day/night cycle, and the combat. The main campaign is at its best when you've been out there on a quest for some time, you're running out of supplies, it's getting dark now, and every sound that comes out of the shadows is one obstacle before you can finally return home. It feels like you're out there traveling, on an adventure. But break down any individual quest or the outside environment and there isn't much there, with a few exceptions here and there (Wyrmking Ring quest).

That said, I do think the combat against larger enemies is pretty compelling. Not only do they nail the aesthetic for a lot of these mythological creatures, but they're engaging in ways most action RPGs (outside of Souls really) are not (climbing on creatures, several unique mechanics for each, being able to disarm the cyclops or kill parts off of the manticore, etc.). They feel appropriately epic. The beholder Evil Eye fights were some of my favorites.

I also thought the Pawn system was really intriguing, specifically the knowledge aspect of it. While I don't think the game uses this to its best potential (it would work better in a more open-ended game, like Kenshi for example), having Pawns gain knowledge about creatures, locations, and quests as a way to assist you is quite novel. Early in the game I recruited a pawn a few levels higher than I was. While exploring the Witchwood they were able to guide me through the dense fog. I thought that was great.

The dungeon diving is pretty good too, especially in Dark Arisen's Bitterblack Isle. I also had a great time with the Mystic Knight. A vocation that focuses on elemental ripostes for your shield, a high-damage area denial spell (Ruinous Sigil), decent melee options, and even a great ranged spell option in the form of Great Cannon.

And as Durante mentioned, I do think the presentation for magic is fantastic. Too often is magic not much different from an archer with elements. These spells feel the part for a powerful sorcerer.
 
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Durante

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I played Dragon's Dogma last year, and I was looking forward to spell casting in this game, and I was left a bit mifffed. The spells look cool, but the novelty of the animations wears of quick, and you are left with spells that are just one-off effects. You can't combine spells, you only get a couple obvious versions for each and since you can only bind 3 (if you are multi-class like i was) or at most 6, you will probably keep using the same few spells the entire game, which further makes spellcasting feel repetitive.

It's not bad system (though I found playing as a pure mage to be pretty bad in terms of balancing early on) , but I didn't understand what about it should be so impressive. Overall, my impression of Dragon's Dogma was of a interesting game, in many ways I get the impression it wants to be highly systemic and almost immersive sim like in terms of player freedom, but just falls short in making a game that ever really works well.
For me, what made the spells so good is that they managed to have a system where powerful spells are "annoying" to use (as in, they have long casting times, or leave you vulnerable, or have very specific hit zones and placement requirements, or all of those) but at the same time also sufficiently powerful for all of that to still feel worth it.

I can't readily think of a single other action-based RPG that actually does this.
Most western action RPGs these days have spells that have almost no casting time or vulnerability. Offensive spells in Elder Scrolls and games inspired by it are basically 30 different ways of firing a colored sphere at enemies. And while Souls games have quite a few spells that have longer casting times and unique effects, they are almost never actually worth it. The Moons in Elden Ring are actually pretty close, but I'm not sure if I frequently used those because it's truly worth it or just because the animation is so awesome.

I do believe this spellcasting tradeoff in Dragon's Dogma is embedded in some decent game design and interaction with other game systems, e.g. it is made much more viable to play a big-spell-focused pure caster since you can build your pawn to tank.
 
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moemoneyb1

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Well I didn't have Marty O'Donnell, composer for Halo, running for congress on my "Wacky things that happened in 2024" bingo card but here we are.
It's also one of those cases of "Never meet your heroes".
 
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